tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post7719922751436159713..comments2024-02-14T06:26:09.116-05:00Comments on Frozen Tropics: Reminder: Streetcar Meeting TonightUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-47460196683044372082011-12-12T10:27:14.301-05:002011-12-12T10:27:14.301-05:00Logan is not actually a neighborhood school. It is...Logan is not actually a neighborhood school. It is a DCPS Montessori that was housed for many years at Watkins elementary and moved this year to the Logan building. It is open to all DC residents, should there be enough available slots.<br />Therefore you have families from all over the Hill and other neighborhoods attending the school. Hence the freak out about parking.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-4370565756576084762011-12-12T10:04:33.541-05:002011-12-12T10:04:33.541-05:00We should give a medal to the first public officia...<i>We should give a medal to the first public official with the balls to say that the Streetcar to Nowhere is total boondoggle and a waste of taxpayer money.</i><br /><br />Why is that? You might just as well give a medal to the public official who's willing to promise free off-street parking to every DC resident. <br /><br />There's really no heroism in telling uninformed reactionaries the pleasant untruths that they desperately want to hear. Heck, Newt Gingrich is the GOP front-runner.oboenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-715563565119479242011-12-11T17:26:13.112-05:002011-12-11T17:26:13.112-05:00Agreed. Public transit is much, much safer than ri...Agreed. Public transit is much, much safer than riding in a car, for adults and children.<br /><br />Anyway, I think if it furthers going to H st/K st downtown the H Street entrance could be better. Especially with an improved pedestrian entrance.H Street Landlordnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-8440969381786622142011-12-11T00:10:20.014-05:002011-12-11T00:10:20.014-05:00"if you get rid of on street parking along th..."if you get rid of on street parking along the route, that problem is solved."<br /><br />...and there we have the real concern behind all this BS.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-51169655772475719862011-12-10T20:06:10.550-05:002011-12-10T20:06:10.550-05:00We should give a medal to the first public officia...We should give a medal to the first public official with the balls to say that the Streetcar to Nowhere is total boondoggle and a waste of taxpayer money.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-65697843464469508282011-12-10T14:17:09.326-05:002011-12-10T14:17:09.326-05:00ps: for those who worry whether the laying of stre...ps: for those who worry whether the laying of streetcar tracks would destroy the historic homes on 3rd street, how'd the homes around the eastern market metro survive that stop's construction? anyone have anecdotal evidence?wylie coyotenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-60639579796905799092011-12-10T14:15:35.044-05:002011-12-10T14:15:35.044-05:003 to 5 year olds would only be "dodging"...3 to 5 year olds would only be "dodging" streetcars if they were riding in traffic. Otherwise, they will be crossing at the crosswalk when it's safe, like they have to do in front of cars. <br /><br />No one is ending vehicular traffic on 3rd because of Logan, so a streetcar is unlikely to cause much additional vehicular threat (the streetcar I have rode on, in New Orleans, went slow enough to jog in front of).<br /><br />The main problem I see with using 3rd is how narrow it is, but if you get rid of on street parking along the route, that problem is solved.wylie coyotenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-89000474556510809652011-12-10T11:48:58.784-05:002011-12-10T11:48:58.784-05:00If Logan is. Neighborhood school, why the traffic ...If Logan is. Neighborhood school, why the traffic jam for drop off? Don't kids walk to school any more?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-88554634752345226762011-12-09T22:31:45.935-05:002011-12-09T22:31:45.935-05:00Some of those you refer to as NIMBYs were parents ...Some of those you refer to as NIMBYs were parents of Logan students, concerned about 32-ton streetcars literally driving in a big-ass circle around their school every 10-20 minutes. The original plan was to turn left on 3rd from H, then right on G to cross in front of Logan, left on 2nd to go down that side of Logan, left on F, then left on 3rd to make sure to circle the last side of Logan. There was also the concern for all the trees around the school being cut down for the height clearance and overhead wires (when Logan kids have been busily planting new trees and gardens), not to mention the basic elimination of the Safe Routes to School program at Logan--how are 3-5 years supposed to bike and walk safely while dodging 68 foot streetcars? I'm pretty sure most people on this site have learned to NEVER drive on 3rd, G or 2nd between 7:30-9a.m. when it's a giant clusterf*!* for Logan drop-off since the streets are so narrow. Throwing streetcars in would have been a disaster.Logan Parentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-70246535571350013302011-12-08T21:40:18.013-05:002011-12-08T21:40:18.013-05:00:D you're welcome:D you're welcomeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-20432019718234245762011-12-08T20:58:33.596-05:002011-12-08T20:58:33.596-05:00@Anon-11:16
hahahahahahaha, omg, hahahahahaha, si...@Anon-11:16 <br />hahahahahahaha, omg, hahahahahaha, sign, NAMBLAemonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-45983980055641994862011-12-07T23:26:03.556-05:002011-12-07T23:26:03.556-05:00if you've ever rode on a modern streetcar (or ...<i>if you've ever rode on a modern streetcar (or even an old one), you'd know that they're nothing like a bus. No climb to board, several doors to board through, and a very smooth and quiet ride in a reasonably spacious vehicle. The complete opposite experience from riding a bus.</i><br /><br />All of this is, of course, true.<br /><br />I think that eventually it's a bit like bikeshare: There's no way to really explain it to some people. You just have to go ahead and implement it, people use it, and then, like bikeshare, a year goes by and it's pretty much uncontroversial.<br /><br />Heck, forty years ago, these same people would be wringing their hands about what a stupid idea commercial jet travel is. Then you implement it, it makes everyone's lives marginally better, doesn't break the bank, and the naysayers pretend it was never controversial.<br /><br />I think it was Blue Oyster Cult that once observed, "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."oboenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-9157479578444113852011-12-07T23:15:07.367-05:002011-12-07T23:15:07.367-05:00Why spend millions on a fancy bus line?
People to...<i> Why spend millions on a fancy bus line?</i><br /><br />People tote this line out, as if non-fancy bus lines <i>don't</i> cost millions to operate. Buses are expensive to purchase, expensive to maintain, and expensive to operate.<br /><br />They also don't last very long, use expensive diesel fuel, and put a not-insignificant amount of wear on the streets.<br /><br />I'm not saying that streetcars are necessarily cheap, although they are known for lasting much, much longer than buses, can carry more people with fewer vehicles (lower labor costs per passenger), and run on cheap electricity. I also believe that they're easier to work on from a maintenance perspective (steel wheels instead of tires; electric motors instead of diesel engines, no transmission). <br /><br />Oh, and if you've ever rode on a modern streetcar (or even an old one), you'd know that they're nothing like a bus. No climb to board, several doors to board through, and a very smooth and quiet ride in a reasonably spacious vehicle. The complete opposite experience from riding a bus.andrewnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-4016088954027148802011-12-07T16:46:15.669-05:002011-12-07T16:46:15.669-05:00I suck at predictions, but that doesn't stop m...I suck at predictions, but that doesn't stop me from making them. I think it's largely dependent on the political climate of the suburbs.<br /><br />One scenario is that we're going to see a continued ascendance of more urban residents in the suburbs as places like Tysons Corner, Rockville, and Gaithersburg grow more and more dense. If that cohort gains the upper hand in elections, we'll likely see a greater emphasis on maintaining transit to complement smart-growth policies.<br /><br />If the proponents of suburban smart-growth fail to execute we could well see political support shrink, and shift towards throwing yet more money to suburban roads at the expense of "discredited boondoggles" like transit.<br /><br />We're kind of at an inflection point.<br /><br />While DC residents will continue to use Metro for as long as (and whatever level of service) the system exists, I can see how austerity measures might impact the level of service to the extent that it's largely a de facto commuter service. You already see slashed hours of operation and headways off-peak. It's not inconceivable that the suburban majority decides to close more stations, cut hours further, etc...<br /><br />And service cuts have a tendency to further erode popular support. It's a vicious cycle.oboenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-2452382243070649072011-12-07T14:42:21.318-05:002011-12-07T14:42:21.318-05:00Oboe: Well said, despite the doom and gloom. But...Oboe: Well said, despite the doom and gloom. But most everyone I know takes metro daily, even the people who actually live in DC! Metro is not going to fail, although it's going to continue to decline. <br /><br />Do you see a day when DC becomes like SF with the suburbanites taking Bart (WMATA) and city folk taking MUNI (DC Streetcar)?Tom A.https://www.blogger.com/profile/10417553647538474302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-92172307970341116292011-12-07T14:27:50.091-05:002011-12-07T14:27:50.091-05:00Oboe- I was hoping this would be part of the metro...<i>Oboe- I was hoping this would be part of the metro system which is known and loved by people all over the world. No one has ever heard of the circulator until they get here. I want this to be treated like a train, not a bus. For example, the green line in Boston is actually light rail, not heavy rail. But it's treated like all of the other lines in Boston. It's on every subway map, etc. No one knows it's "just" a streetcar line.</i><br /><br />I can see where you're coming from on this, but I think you're overstating the case a bit. People who live in the DC area have a much more gimlet-eyed view of Metro than "people around the world." In fact, as far as DC residents go, I don't know many people who take a metro bus when a Circulator is an option.<br /><br />Not to be a "doomer" but one could make the argument that Metro is in a state of slow collapse. It's resurgence is going to be dependent on the whims of political interests in Richmond, Annapolis, and the feds. Currently the Metro board has eight members, two of those represent DC. The interests of the other six do not necessarily line up with the interests of DC.<br /><br />If Metro is going to continue to be allowed to fall apart by suburban and down-state interests, it's going to be more and more critical to DC's interests to have a system that is focused on getting DC residents around town rather than predominately getting suburban commuters into town. <br /><br />Coupled with the Circulator, and CaBi, the streetcar fits in nicely.oboenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-50270743524673799922011-12-07T14:05:59.114-05:002011-12-07T14:05:59.114-05:00Not sure whether Mayor Gray attended Logan, but my...Not sure whether Mayor Gray attended Logan, but my understanding is that he grew up around 6th & L St NE, so he should be quite familiar with the neighborhood.Alan Pagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07349389379428110815noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-64780864953352674662011-12-07T13:03:35.138-05:002011-12-07T13:03:35.138-05:00I attended the meeting last night... got there abo...I attended the meeting last night... got there about 5-10 mins early and it was already packed. The Mayor commented that this was a very full meeting and it seemed that he was not used to seeing his community meetings quite this full. For those who didn't make it inside, it is a real, full-scale auditorium. Tommy Wells later jokingly commented that it was a great trick to say that the tracks would go down 2nd and 3rd streets as it increased public attendance.<br /><br />I don't live near 2nd and 3rd, but do live near 12th street. I have supported the idea of trolleys/streetcars but was always under the impression they would be only along the commercial corridor. I was very happy to hear the Mayor immediately say at the begining of the meeting that the options for the streetcars to go down 2nd and 3rd were non-starters. <br /><br />It sounded like the Mayor may have attended the Logan school when he was young as he knew how narrow those streets are and that no way could they support a streetcar. He was essentially saying no streetcar on those streets on his watch. I don't know about the turn around mentioned on the above posts as I left just after Tommy Wells began to speak. Maybe someone else can comment to that?<br /><br />The Engineer in charge, Nich Nicholson, said that the Mayor made clear that the streetcar would go to the top of the hopscotch bridge. Pedestrians would then walk to metro from there. From my understanding it is not possible to arrange for a turn-around in the garage and that the streetcar conductor would just walk to the rear of the car and drive it from that position. The Mayor did say that this is what he envisioned the conductors doing.<br /><br />I really hope the December 20th meeting is re-scheduled for a different date. We need participation. The Engineer and this team seem very interested in public feedback. Input could really make any buildings, the new carbarn, or transformer building, much more estetically pleasing and perhaps even useful so that other businesses could be located on the same property. We don't want the carbarn area to look like the rail tracks behind Union Station. Bethesda did manage to put their bus garage under an office building. It would be great to see the land use for the carbarn done well.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-69619404692812716982011-12-07T12:39:54.796-05:002011-12-07T12:39:54.796-05:00The 20+ DC employees sitting down front should hav...The 20+ DC employees sitting down front should have given up their seats. But now that the NIMBYs won't be back, future meetings should be smaller. I'm looking forward to a meeting where more potential riders will be in attendence. With all of us white folks in the room, I thought I must have missed a recent Groupon or something.Tom A.https://www.blogger.com/profile/10417553647538474302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-36467371519631203652011-12-07T12:00:33.927-05:002011-12-07T12:00:33.927-05:00It's too bad that some people could not make i...It's too bad that some people could not make it in but there are fire code regulations and Atlas could be fined for breaking them. Considering Atlas donated the use of the space and incurred the cost of paying at least two staff people to be there I think we need to be more understanding and have respect for the law and for public safety.<br />The room was packed, standing room packed and letting everyone in would have been dangerous.<br />It's unfortunate but the theatre can not be made bigger.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-84376634819961209642011-12-07T11:46:44.654-05:002011-12-07T11:46:44.654-05:00i was one of the people that was told couldn't...i was one of the people that was told couldn't go in due to capacity issues, which was infuriating as I rushed to leave work "early" in order to get there a bit after 7pm. was told to come to dec 20 mtg, which starts at 6pm....um hello, it was hard enough to make a 7pm mtg, how is a 6pm one any consolation or more helpful??? however, after a few ANC reps and other electeds were welcomed in late as i stood there i made a bit of a stink in lobby about being let in if they were allowing those folks in. technically, those electeds should, and likely do, have more access to mayor/ddot folks than i do to get this info. the guy wound up relenting and many folks were let in from that point on. ridiculous.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-63482551223949222442011-12-07T11:16:02.151-05:002011-12-07T11:16:02.151-05:00NIMBY: North American Man/Boy Love AssociationNIMBY: North American Man/Boy Love AssociationAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-56603791884183283012011-12-07T11:09:16.000-05:002011-12-07T11:09:16.000-05:00NIMBY: Not In My BackYardNIMBY: Not In My BackYardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-77567150523157953902011-12-07T10:42:21.846-05:002011-12-07T10:42:21.846-05:00The union WMATA system would cost tons more money ...The union WMATA system would cost tons more money than the Circulator. Nor is WMTA responsive to customer needs. They have to hold a press conference when they ix a escalator. I think that we will be better off under local control.<br />I'm pretty sure that google and bing will be adding the street car to their mapAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8835710.post-66883325151612848752011-12-07T10:34:31.597-05:002011-12-07T10:34:31.597-05:00Yep. The nimbys were something else. Clearly and l...Yep. The nimbys were something else. Clearly and loudly uninformed. It was a good thing that Gray and Wells caved so quickly, otherwise we would not have been able to discuss or listen to anything else besides how the world would end if the streetcar went down 2nd St. Too bad these folks are not working on ending DC hunger.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com