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Wednesday, September 14, 2011

THIH: A Liquor License Cap For H Street?

Liquor -Night 2
The Hill is Home covers the hot topic of whether we're ready to cap the number of liquor licenses on H Street. ANC6A has look at, and tabled the issue, before but it's back. It should make for some exciting ANC 6A meetings. The fnext meeting is Tuesday September 20th at 7pm at Sherwood Rec. Discussions also over at the City Paper , DCist, and Prince of Petworth.
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27 comments:

RPW said...

I'm bracing myself for the flurry of opinions on this topic.

Anonymous said...

I don't care how many liquor licenses they give out, just don't let those places sell lotto tickets. That liquor store at 3rd and H is like an OTB, like that convenient s(t)ore down at 11th. Lotto just really attracts an undesirable element (much like public transport).

Anonymous said...

Who keeps bringing up the moratorium issue? Is there a petition somewhere? I would not be surprised, if Englert is behind this to protect his near monopoly.

Anonymous said...

I would like to know if there's a petition too so I can sign it.

Anonymous said...

I think it's kept behind the bar @ the Argo. Call first.

curmudgeon said...

Anon 8:33am -- All the conspiracy theories re: Joe Englert crack me up.

At the first meeting I remember on this topic, at ANC6A's ABL committee meeting back in 2007, there were a couple of folks there who seemed to be suggesting that they represented MOTH, and they were strongly in favor of an *immediate* moratorium, which was not even what was being discussed. Imagine that -- licenses frozen at the spring 2007 level. When I suggested that might be a bit premature, I was accused of being an employee of Joe Englert, there to make sure that no moratorium occurred.

FOLKS: what's being discussed at these meetings is not (necessarily) an immediate cap on licenses. What's being discussed is whether we will ever want one; and if so, at what level? If a sensible limit on licenses for a certain area is (to pick a random number) 30, you don't want to start talking about it when you've already passed that number, or even when it's just reached 28.

The common refrain around here is that people don't want H Street NE to become the next Adams-Morgan. The time to talk about this issue is well before it's happened and it's too late to do something about it.

Jesse said...

I like the idea of creating regulation to keep small businesses from opening and creating jobs for local residents.

Anonymous said...

Jesse: A crack dealing operation is a small business that provides jobs for local residents.

No, I am not equating crack dealing with bars and restaurants. I'm simply suggesting that maybe, just maybe, issues are best considered by doing more than just throwing out an oversimplified one-liner? I know that's probably wishful thinking around here, but still.

Anonymous said...

I know people get rowdy on Adam's Morgan, and we don't want that kind of headache. But, the neighborhoods surrounding Adams Morgan are very popular and nice. Upon learning where I live, I have had several people tell me that they would have never come to my neighborhood if it were not for the bars and restaurants. They go on to say that it is a great/cool/fun neighborhood.

I believe that bars and restaurants traffic help drive neighborhood growth and investment. Everyone says that bars and restaurants are the pioneers in a rebuilding neighborhood, so I would be very reticent to limit them with so many empty store fronts on H.

Anonymous said...

amen10:54

Hill North said...

The license cap is a very bad idea.

The bars and restaurants who are willing to take the risk to invest in the area are driving the growth. It would be an absolute shame to block someone who is willing to take a vacant run-down storefront and improve it.

It wouldn't suprise me if parking issues aren't the underlying genesis for this misguided idea. Either that or folks pining for more retail. However, more retail won't come about without more density. If you want more retail (and less bars), encouraging more mixed-use residential development like the now semingly stalled H Sreet Connection redo and other similar projects is the smart move.

Also, there are only are something like 20 new bars and restaurants along a 13-block stretch of H Street NE. I'd say that is hardly out of control.

Anonymous said...

It's a bit misleading to say "there are only are something like 20 new bars and restaurants along a 13-block stretch of H Street NE. I'd say that is hardly out of control."

about 15 of those new bars and restaurants opened along a three-block stretch.

Looked at from that perspective, things are indeed getting a bit overbuilt in that particular stretch and parking for residents and visitors alike, parking is reaching a crisis point. Some ideas to help resolve this are absolutely something that should be discussed in relation to any continued growth of liquor/restaurant/entertainment licenses that intend to bring even more out-of-neighborhood visitors to the area.

curmudgeon said...

Hill North wrote: Also, there are only are something like 20 new bars and restaurants along a 13-block stretch of H Street NE. I'd say that is hardly out of control.

Sigh. Again, what's being suggested is *not* to cap liquor licenses to what's present now. What's being suggested is to consider whether there should be *some* sort of limit, and if so, what that limit should be. You may be opposed to any kind of limit at all, at any level; but at least accurately portray what's being considered.

You're right, 20 bar/restaurants with liquor licenses isn't out of control. The questions being asked are:

1. Is there some number that *would* be out of control?

2. If so, what's that number?

If you're opposed to these meetings, then your job is to argue why it's wrong to even ask these two questions.

Anonymous said...

@curmudgeon

Spoken like a true Englert stooge. 6a might be lost but we still can save 6c.

Josh said...

I'm strongly opposed to any sort of liquor license cap for H Street. Short and simple. I don't see a need for a cap.

curmudgeon said...

Anon 6:34pm -- spoken like a true anonymous coward.

I have no idea whether I'm in favor of a cap on licenses at any level at all or not. But I do agree that if you're going to discuss the idea at all, the time to have that discussion is now, and not when it's too late for a cap to have any effect -- having the conversation then would make no logical sense at all.

If being logical makes me an "Englert stooge", well, your reliance on ad hominem rather than logic makes you a simple internet troll. I'd certainly rather be logical and willing to listen to other people than that.

Jen said...

I just need to clarify something curmudgeon said earlier about MOTH supporting a moratorium in 2007. I'm a founder and moderator of the group and we do not take positions of this nature, pro or con. The opinions of the members are too diverse for that.
Unfortunately sometimes people think they can speak for the 3000 members of the list serve which is what happened there.

curmudgeon said...

jen: yeah, I tried to put it that way ("suggesting that they represented MOTH" rather than "representing MOTH"); I'm sorry if I didn't explain that well.

Anonymous said...

I think ANC 6A has already taken a stand, they are just going through the motion of getting your opinion. As stated earlier, the idea of an moratorium was rejected but here we go again.
Then there is this:
Review of letter, dated September 9, 2011, from ANC 6A protesting a license for Da Luft Restaurant & Lounge based upon the threat to peace, order, and quiet of the neighborhood. The ANC is also troubled that there may be an adverse impact on residential parking as well as concerns about trash, loitering, and pedestrian safety. Nearyby property risks may be at risk because the rear of the property abuts residential property across a very narrow valley. Da Luft Restaurant & Lounge, 1242 H Street NE Retailer CR, Lic.#: 87780

Anonymous said...

Its hard to complain that most of the bars are opening up in a specific portion of H street when that fits with the original masterplan for the the street.

Living on the west end of the corridor, I never understood why they wanted to make an "entertainment" district, a housing district and a retail/office district on different segments of the street. It would make much more sense to see bars and restraunts sprout up over the length of the street. I would love to have more bars and restaurants closer to me. True Orleans is too expensive for it to be that kind of place for me. Maybe Big Board will do the trick.

bob hope said...

and now cue up the douchbag Big Board comments....ready...go...

peter parker said...

I never understand people complaining about parking. If you live in the city you must be willing to walk a few blocks from where you live or else you may as well move into a 2 car garage single family home in the burbs. Seriously how lazy have we become that we need rock star parking 24x7. Besides a little walk doesn't hurt anybody but rather will do your body good.

Jesse said...

We knew this neighborhood was going to turn into something crazy (used in the good sense) when we moved in over 7 years ago...not having parking, having bars/restaurants popup every several months, and dealing with "city" life shouldn't be a surprise to anyone who has moved in since.

All the seniors and old-timers who weathered the bad times and now are feeling the pressure of a revitalized neighborhood...sorry.

Anonymous said...

This senior is glad to see the changes and I live a lot closer to the 1200 and 1300 blocks than curmudgeon. Who thrives in theory world. We don't need a moratorium. If noise is a problem then stop approving those quaint out door patios. Run the parking meters and residential parking until midnight.

hounddog said...

Agree 100% anon 9:03.

I think that this is all about parking and noise. A cap is not the right solution. There are other more appropriate ways to deal with those issues. A cap would hurt needed growth along the whole corridor and drive off those willing to invest.

Not to mention, putting licenses in the hands of a select few will hurt competition and quality. A cap will create a fixed number of crappy bars and taverns. A little competition is a good thing.

curmudgeon said...

Anon 9:03pm -- I live three blocks from the 1200 block of H. For you to suggest that that's not close enough for me to do nothing more than simply suggest that all opinions should be heard is truly stunning. Maybe someplace with tighter control on public speech would be more your perfect place to live?

Anonymous said...

Sorry curmudgeon, i thought that you lived near the HT and the New York Av metro station