A look at what's going on in Trinidad, on H Street, and in the larger area north of Capitol Hill.
Thursday, February 21, 2008
In Shaw: Popping Up All Over
One of these things is not like the other ones In Shaw looks at pop-ups and neighbors with height differences to further her argument that not all pop-ups have to be bad.
Glad you posted that link, dc. I just recently came upon that building while driving home from Whole Foods. One misconception is that somehow they should not have gotten permits. If the zoning permits that size of an addition(which I understand it did) there is nothing DCRA can do regarding the design and look.
Mari, you are correct. I believe these guys actually received three stop work orders before they finally had their license yanked. Here's the best part, these creeps applied not for a new construction permit, but for a permit to construct an addition...to an existing two story home. They then demolished that home after it became structurally unsound. Possibly because they dug a giant pit right next to it. And perhaps you will recall the news story Northeast House Topples Over that discusses what happened to a smaller part of that house [it fell into the giant pit]. Did I mention the house to which the eleven unit condo building was supposedly an addition didn't appear in the blue prints? Oops! Seriously, you wouldn't believe the pleadings filed on this one.
Is this the condo building on Morse St. NE? I see that thing everyday when I come and go from my house. It looks even prettier now that it is wrapped in Tyvek, It looks like a Christmas present that nobody wants.
My contractor looked at it and said that the wood shouldn't have been exposed as long as it was and that that may create problems down the road.
el guapo, this is on Morse. Yeah, the wood is definitely going to be a problem for the developer. But do I have a bit of sympathy for the builder/developer? No way. This building has been a magnet for squatters, crackheads who want to steal materials to sell for drugs, kids who hang out in there and then throw stuff at people [they hit my neighbor in the head, giving him a mild concussion], and illegal dumping. Also, they illegally dug a deep and poorly marked car sized pit in the alley. I believe they were fined over 10k for that alone. I could continue. Their filings with various agencies are complete works of fiction. The Tyvek wrapping follows the most recent order to secure the building, but you will note that the Tyvek was quickly ripped off and windows reopened, so perhaps it is occupied again.
I have similar doubts about the house on the 1200 block of Maryland Ave being rebuilt into what I think are condos. They had the original facade standing for a while, but that toppled a few months ago and the new one is 100% generic, suburban design ugly.
I wonder if restoring the original facade would have cost more than what they've built now.
They added some brickwork to the roofline that helped it blend in a bit, but it's still god-awful compared to its neighbors.
The unpainted brick brigade can crucify me now, but I actually think it'd look worlds better if they put a decent color over it, rather than the dark brown brick that doesn't seem to exist anywhere else in the vicinity.
Claudio, the building on 1200 block of Maryland was on the agenda last night at the 6A Zoning Committee meeting. I believe that 6A is going to appeal the permits. This building is not in the historic district and if it was, the facade that exists now would not be acceptable.
I know that alot of folks are very much opposed to historic districts, but I am thankful everyday that I live in one.
There are so many interesting and charming neighborhoods west of 16th street. It breaks my heart to see some of this stuff.
've seen the Tyvek coming apart but now the trick is to get the city to do something about it.
I think at this point, the damn thing needs to be torn down completely or at least to the framing provided that is still good.
It is an eyesore. I only see it when I leave my house so it isn't a big deal but I heard what happened to the neighbor in question and I heard that he had to take a bit of time off to recover from it.
i'm so glad you picked up on prince of petworth, and inshaws posts on pop-ups.
it's an interesting topic and very relevant to our area.
i think it would be interesting to do an anonymous poll to see how many people that read this blog do work on their homes without the requisite permits.
does everyone get a permit for the work they do on their homes?
My house has been extensively renovated by numerous previous owners. I went to the DCRA to check historical permits and there was nothing in the file except for the permits for the work I had done. I thought it was a mistake and talked to the office and they told me that a lot of work in D.C. is done without permits.
I'm planning to add a three foot high wrought iron fence to the front of my house this spring/summer. I'll go through the hoopla and get a permit for that.
I cut down 5 trees without a permit. I tore siding off my house without a permit. I ripped up my entire concrete backyard without a permit. I am glad that I dont live in a historical district.
I wonder if there are any statistics re real estate values in communities where citizens essentially abide by the permit laws and/or have some design/historic guidelines vs. those where owners do as they please. Obviously, in New Mexico, Idaho, Wyoming, etc. zoning is very loose or nonexistent(you can have a landfill next to your log house)but I am talking about cities, where some level of civility needs to exist. In many neighborhoods people share walls and fences.
DC is not competent enough to issue and police permits. DCRA is a huge problem. And some of this minor work is irrelevant compared to the things that are getting through. So we have a situation where everyone and anyone does what they want, thinking what they do is good(and that really is only personal opinion). It may be and it may not be...we probably all do a certain amount of work without permits.
Here is why some people dont get permits in this city - - not that they are avoiding the rules, but that its virtually impossible to deal with DCRA. While there is little excuse for some of the hideous additions, which of course get the most attention and overshadow the real issue - - the hidden truth is that in many instances it is not the homeowner -its DCRA permitting process. In fact, one of their guys who monitors for permit violations was a convicted felon (massive ammunition possession, attempted murder, massive stocks of drug posession) yet he had a badge and full legal backing of the DCRA. If you are pursuing a permit for anything other than the most simplest of work, my experience with DCRA was a complete nightmare in getting a permit. They lose your paperwork, you dont have any idea who to talk to next, you have no idea where your application is in the process - - it takes at least 9 months, and you must keep on them repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly. Typically its recommended that you hire a permit expediter. You know its bad when you must hire what is essentially a consultant to navigate the process. And you know its bad when you call your city councilperson and they say, "well, yeah, thats the way it is."
Or you have the case where the owners of a commercial development have been notified by the director herself that there are several problems with the permit, the permit has holds on it with instructions that only the director or the ZA can clear and the permit is issued on a Friday afternoon at close of business, most likely by one of the idiots who can never find the paperwork or the plans or their brains(but probably know how to put their hand out). The holds still exist. The permit was issued "in error" to the expeditor. I'm not aware that anyone was fired...yet. The permit was revoked and the owners refuse to give it back, so now it is in court.
They can never find your plans or your paperwork but any fly by night contractor/developer who wants to turn a rowhome into a 50 unit condo building that occupies 100% of the lot(in a 60%, 2 unit zoning district) and as an extra bonus he's using public space for part of the building and he's providing one parking space, gets a permit.
DCRA is a complete mess. We have always hired a permit expeditor for our home projects...guess we have just lived in the District too long.
I'm the guy (anon 11:29) who wants to add a fence to the front of my house this spring. I've heard that dealing with the DCRA is a pain in the ass -- and already had a contractor tell me that he won't deal with the DCRA because of it. I was planning to get a permit just to be 'legal' and avoid any issues. I don't think any of my neighbors would complain -- I'm planning to do something tasteful and not do chain link thing (If any of you have them, PLEASE replace them with something better. They are complete eyesores... and no, painting them makes them uglier! :) ).
So what is the consensus ... Should I deal with the hell that is DCRA to get the permit or just proceed?
Any consensus on getting a permit for a roof deck? I plan on putting it far enough back that it cannot be seen from the front of our house. Should I go through the trouble of applying for a permit?
Permits are required by law. I'm guessing that you will probably use a contractor to do the work. A reputable contractor should obtain the permit. If they won't, it's a red flag. Putting up a roof deck is major work. Despite what some say, permits do serve a purpose and you can get a nasty fine if you don't have one. So just get one.
24 comments:
Well the house is certainly out of proportion with the rest of the block, but as long as they choose siding that looks nice, it might not be that bad!
Remeber this DC house built in NE? It's twice the height of surrounding buildings, plus it's yellow!!!!!
Amanda
Glad you posted that link, dc. I just recently came upon that building while driving home from Whole Foods. One misconception is that somehow they should not have gotten permits. If the zoning permits that size of an addition(which I understand it did) there is nothing DCRA can do regarding the design and look.
Hey aren't those orange "Stop Work" orders I see on the building?
Mari, you are correct. I believe these guys actually received three stop work orders before they finally had their license yanked. Here's the best part, these creeps applied not for a new construction permit, but for a permit to construct an addition...to an existing two story home. They then demolished that home after it became structurally unsound. Possibly because they dug a giant pit right next to it. And perhaps you will recall the news story Northeast House Topples Over that discusses what happened to a smaller part of that house [it fell into the giant pit]. Did I mention the house to which the eleven unit condo building was supposedly an addition didn't appear in the blue prints? Oops! Seriously, you wouldn't believe the pleadings filed on this one.
Welcome to DC and the world of DCRA.
Is this the condo building on Morse St. NE? I see that thing everyday when I come and go from my house. It looks even prettier now that it is wrapped in Tyvek, It looks like a Christmas present that nobody wants.
My contractor looked at it and said that the wood shouldn't have been exposed as long as it was and that that may create problems down the road.
el guapo, this is on Morse. Yeah, the wood is definitely going to be a problem for the developer. But do I have a bit of sympathy for the builder/developer? No way. This building has been a magnet for squatters, crackheads who want to steal materials to sell for drugs, kids who hang out in there and then throw stuff at people [they hit my neighbor in the head, giving him a mild concussion], and illegal dumping. Also, they illegally dug a deep and poorly marked car sized pit in the alley. I believe they were fined over 10k for that alone. I could continue. Their filings with various agencies are complete works of fiction. The Tyvek wrapping follows the most recent order to secure the building, but you will note that the Tyvek was quickly ripped off and windows reopened, so perhaps it is occupied again.
I have similar doubts about the house on the 1200 block of Maryland Ave being rebuilt into what I think are condos. They had the original facade standing for a while, but that toppled a few months ago and the new one is 100% generic, suburban design ugly.
I wonder if restoring the original facade would have cost more than what they've built now.
They added some brickwork to the roofline that helped it blend in a bit, but it's still god-awful compared to its neighbors.
The unpainted brick brigade can crucify me now, but I actually think it'd look worlds better if they put a decent color over it, rather than the dark brown brick that doesn't seem to exist anywhere else in the vicinity.
Claudio, the building on 1200 block of Maryland was on the agenda last night at the 6A Zoning Committee meeting. I believe that 6A is going to appeal the permits. This building is not in the historic district and if it was, the facade that exists now would not be acceptable.
I know that alot of folks are very much opposed to historic districts, but I am thankful everyday that I live in one.
There are so many interesting and charming neighborhoods west of 16th street. It breaks my heart to see some of this stuff.
've seen the Tyvek coming apart but now the trick is to get the city to do something about it.
I think at this point, the damn thing needs to be torn down completely or at least to the framing provided that is still good.
It is an eyesore. I only see it when I leave my house so it isn't a big deal but I heard what happened to the neighbor in question and I heard that he had to take a bit of time off to recover from it.
i'm so glad you picked up on prince of petworth, and inshaws posts on pop-ups.
it's an interesting topic and very relevant to our area.
i think it would be interesting to do an anonymous poll to see how many people that read this blog do work on their homes without the requisite permits.
does everyone get a permit for the work they do on their homes?
My house has been extensively renovated by numerous previous owners. I went to the DCRA to check historical permits and there was nothing in the file except for the permits for the work I had done. I thought it was a mistake and talked to the office and they told me that a lot of work in D.C. is done without permits.
I'm planning to add a three foot high wrought iron fence to the front of my house this spring/summer. I'll go through the hoopla and get a permit for that.
I cut down 5 trees without a permit.
I tore siding off my house without a permit.
I ripped up my entire concrete backyard without a permit.
I am glad that I dont live in a historical district.
I wonder if there are any statistics re real estate values in communities where citizens essentially abide by the permit laws and/or have some design/historic guidelines vs. those where owners do as they please. Obviously, in New Mexico, Idaho, Wyoming, etc. zoning is very loose or nonexistent(you can have a landfill next to your log house)but I am talking about cities, where some level of civility needs to exist. In many neighborhoods people share walls and fences.
i turned a window into a door, without a permit.
i'm wondering what the hell permits are for?
i've added to my neighborhood by making my house bigger and better.
does dc even check up on this stuff?
i know my neighbors won't 'turn me in', because my work is adding value to the neighborhood.
it's so funny to think that dc is competent enough to allocate permits, let alone check up on them.
just look at the "pop ups".
i'm thinking that savvy folks are simply getting the work done.
dc just screws things up, and DELAYS important projects.
i'm not talking about structural work...
a fence is simple and stupid. why would you need a permit for that???
DC is not competent enough to issue and police permits. DCRA is a huge problem. And some of this minor work is irrelevant compared to the things that are getting through. So we have a situation where everyone and anyone does what they want, thinking what they do is good(and that really is only personal opinion). It may be and it may not be...we probably all do a certain amount of work without permits.
Here is why some people dont get permits in this city - - not that they are avoiding the rules, but that its virtually impossible to deal with DCRA. While there is little excuse for some of the hideous additions, which of course get the most attention and overshadow the real issue - - the hidden truth is that in many instances it is not the homeowner -its DCRA permitting process. In fact, one of their guys who monitors for permit violations was a convicted felon (massive ammunition possession, attempted murder, massive stocks of drug posession) yet he had a badge and full legal backing of the DCRA. If you are pursuing a permit for anything other than the most simplest of work, my experience with DCRA was a complete nightmare in getting a permit. They lose your paperwork, you dont have any idea who to talk to next, you have no idea where your application is in the process - - it takes at least 9 months, and you must keep on them repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly. Typically its recommended that you hire a permit expediter. You know its bad when you must hire what is essentially a consultant to navigate the process. And you know its bad when you call your city councilperson and they say, "well, yeah, thats the way it is."
Or you have the case where the owners of a commercial development have been notified by the director herself that there are several problems with the permit, the permit has holds on it with instructions that only the director or the ZA can clear and the permit is issued on a Friday afternoon at close of business, most likely by one of the idiots who can never find the paperwork or the plans or their brains(but probably know how to put their hand out). The holds still exist. The permit was issued "in error" to the expeditor. I'm not aware that anyone was fired...yet. The permit was revoked and the owners refuse to give it back, so now it is in court.
They can never find your plans or your paperwork but any fly by night contractor/developer who wants to turn a rowhome into a 50 unit condo building that occupies 100% of the lot(in a 60%, 2 unit zoning district) and as an extra bonus he's using public space for part of the building and he's providing one parking space, gets a permit.
DCRA is a complete mess. We have always hired a permit expeditor for our home projects...guess we have just lived in the District too long.
I'm the guy (anon 11:29) who wants to add a fence to the front of my house this spring. I've heard that dealing with the DCRA is a pain in the ass -- and already had a contractor tell me that he won't deal with the DCRA because of it. I was planning to get a permit just to be 'legal' and avoid any issues. I don't think any of my neighbors would complain -- I'm planning to do something tasteful and not do chain link thing (If any of you have them, PLEASE replace them with something better. They are complete eyesores... and no, painting them makes them uglier! :) ).
So what is the consensus ... Should I deal with the hell that is DCRA to get the permit or just proceed?
just my opinion, but i say 'go for it'.
i've done substantial work to my place without permits. so have my neighbors - all without any problems.
i could see trying for a permit if you're doing a major addition to your house (i.e. a third or fourth story), but a fence?!
nah. i don't think anyone would even bat an eyelash (or whatever the term is).
i think dc is mostly preoccupied with structural additions, and they don't give a shit about those.
don't waste your time and money, and go forth to improve the hood!
btw, is it just me, or does the white house in the picture look like a face sticking it's tongue out?
Any consensus on getting a permit for a roof deck? I plan on putting it far enough back that it cannot be seen from the front of our house. Should I go through the trouble of applying for a permit?
Permits are required by law. I'm guessing that you will probably use a contractor to do the work. A reputable contractor should obtain the permit. If they won't, it's a red flag. Putting up a roof deck is major work. Despite what some say, permits do serve a purpose and you can get a nasty fine if you don't have one. So just get one.
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