A look at what's going on in Trinidad, on H Street, and in the larger area north of Capitol Hill.
Thursday, May 29, 2008
WP: Fear and Loathing in Rosedale
The Post paints a rather dark portrait of life in the Rosedale neighborhood. Just as a note, the article doesn't mention this fact, but Glady's Mack is the Commissioner for 6A07.
"Assistant Police Chief Diane Groomes blamed a spillover of trouble from the nearby Trinidad neighborhood and said that police patrols have increased."
Wow, my Dad lived on 15th Street in the 60s, and remembers Rosedale and Gails being horrible even back then. To blame this on spillover from Trinidad is really unfortunate. Trinidad has it's problems, but Rosedale is kinda where we were a few years ago. There is still higher than I would like it crime here, but it's nothing like Rosedale up here however, and I live in not so spruced up sections of Trinidad.
Maybe I am being protective of my neighborhood, and so I took offense to the statement. Rosedale and Trinidad barely share a boarder. Trinidad is north of Florida, south of Mt. Olivet West of Bladensburg's Road, East of West Virginia. The only way to get there from Trinidad would be to run diagonally from the Delta Towers to the Pentacle. I am sure the rash of violence isn't caused by gun toting senior citizens.
I know long time residents who won’t even set foot in Rosedale because of its long standing, 30+ year, and reputation for violence.
The Violence down there isn't new, and I take issues with the City’s pin the tail on the donkey strategy, of blaming Trinidad for Rosedale's recent spike in crime.
The article is way over the top. I took the spillover comment from Groomes to be a reference to the fact that certain guys from both Trinidad and Langston who in that sort of life tend to have a rivalry with similar guys from Rosedale and those conflicts often seem to play out violently in Rosedale. My perception is that crime is higher in Rosedale than in most, if not all, of Trinidad, but I'd have to check the stats.
At any rate, I don't think the article is even close to an accurate portrayal of the overall situation in Rosedale. Another fine Post offering where the reporter had a story already written in her head and then sought out quotes and facts to support that article while ignoring anything that contradicts it.
yet another article by the post that portrays the black community as a war zone. they make it seem like rosedale is right up there with haiti. eh, that's mass media for 'ya.
I moved to Trinidad a few years ago and I cannot wait to move out in a few months. The violence in Trinidad and Rosedale is just absurd. It amazes me that just a few (hundred) rotten apples can really spoil an entire neighborhood.
I'm just curious as to why this article is so "over the top". I do not agree that the problems are a result of "spillover" from Trinidad.
It does feel as if Rosedale is a "war zone" as times and nothing is being done about it. Maybe this article can bring some of the issues (such as the gigantic problem with the rec center)to the attention of someone who will pay attention.
For me the violence isn't the biggest issue, it's the number of crazy drugged out crack (and other drug) addicts running around, making life very unpleasant for the rest of us, especially with their hysterical screaming at 3am. And the police are VERY jaded, perhaps to the point of being ineffective. When I moved to the neighborhood people pointed out where the local crack dealer lives- with her many children. I went to a district police meeting in February, and the cops nonchalantly pointed out which apartment complex you go to to get different drugs. For you Frozen Tropics readers who are interested, Pentacle is where you go to get your pot, The one where the girl was shot (I forget the name) is where you pick up your crack, and all of your PCP needs are met at Benning Court.
The day after two people high on PCP were being held on the ground on the street in front of my house a month ago, I asked a patrol office if he'd heard about the incident. He hadn't, and then he added, "That's when you know summer is here!"
MCC: I doesn't seem like Rosedale is a war zone to me. It just seems like a neighborhood with kids running amok- like hundreds of puppies off their leashes with no supervision.
The rec center itself isn't a problem, it's the dozens of kids hanging out there unsupervised, with nothing to do, at all hours of the night. Someday- in 5 years or so, there will be a new rec center, and the grounds will probably be locked up at night.
MCC, Rosedale does have violence problems. I'm not denying that. What I'm saying is that there is more to the neighborhood and the article totally ignores that except for as brief mention of Cafe Roma. And then it thrusts the story straight back into shooting gallery mode with that final quote. I'm just saying the author here is hamming it up more than a little, and I don't think the overall picture is very accurate. I don't think the typical resident is moving their beds away from the windows for fear of stray bullets. My favorite quote has to be “When Rosedale residents get together, the talk is of the latest gun battle, the police helicopter searchlights that disturbed the past night's sleep, the neighbor who barely escaped tragedy.“ Seriously? Those are the most common topics of conversation? I don't think so.
The trinidad area for as long as anyone can remember has always been dangerous and filled with crack heads. Community members need to stop wasting their time trying to figure out how to stop all the criminal activity going on and focus on the bigger, long term solution: EDUCATION. As long as eduction is not there, you can expect to see this going on forever, or at least until the yuppies take over the neighborhood.
Some might argue that it's the parents' fault, not the education. Well, the parents who're selling crack and have 6 kids probably didn't have an education either, which is why they are where they are right now.
Inked- FYI: The last conversation I had with my neighbors was about the amazing meal I had at Langston Bar and Grill- also in Rosedale/Kingman Park. It was perhaps the best roast chicken I've ever had!
Violence doesn't always have to come in the form of someone getting shot (although that does happen in this neighborhood)-what able people getting harassed and beaten?
The rec center is a problem because it is a shell of a building with no supervision present. It provides benches, stoops and various other places for people to do their drugs with some shelter. And yes, I can point out where the crack dealers live as well-so why do the police not stop this?
The young children who actually try to play on the playground have to deal with crack bags, knives, liquor bottles and people who should not be there.
It's a central meeting places for children (and adults) who have nothing else to do to but hang out-yet there are no activities, rules or control. The basketball courts are a 24 hour scream fest.
These folks who use the rec center as a hang out intimidate the entire neighborhood all hours of the night. It could be used as a resource for this community but is not, at all.
inked-Yes, I do think when neighbors get together that a first topic of conversation may be what is happening in that neighborhood as far as crime and violence. I live directly across from the rec center and it seems like there is always something to be concerned about. The neighbors look out for each and this is one way to do that.
There is more to the neighborhood, I agree. I love it there! But it also scares me at times. I didn't see the article as trying to encompass all that the neighborhood is but trying to point out a problem.
mcc: I feel your pain if you live across from the rec center! I often walk my dog at the rec center. We're meeting another dog there tomorrow morning at 7am if you want to come say hello! The field is beautiful when it's deserted!
Thanks Tom. I do agree-it absolutely peaceful and beautiful in the early morning.
I have dogs as well. If I have the time I'll step over. If not-another time for sure.
And I do want to add that I think this is an important string of conversation because I do wonder if the problems in this area are really being paid attention to.
i have been going to many of the psa 103 meetings since I moved to rosedale 2 and half years ago and the commanders frequently blame crimes in our hood as being the result of spillover from Trinidad. It always struck me as a bit glib and self serving as if rosedale doesn't have its own share of home grown knuckleheads. Over a year ago residents including myself along the 16th street corridor began complaining about a noticeable uptick in violence and suspicious activity along the stretches of 15th, 16th, and 17th streets from gales down south to c street. The police response was dismissive, pointing to outdated statistics showing crime is down, ignoring the pleas of residents who repeatedly pointed out incidents of crime or would-be crime that were unlikely to show up in the stats. It wasn't until the shootouts this spring (one of which the post story referenced) before the police presence and response was increased in the area. this more than anything else is a big part of why I will likely leave this neighborhood.
I'm not saying we all have to love each other, but can we get a bit of empathy, on the level of "those kids could be my kids if I were in different circumstances" or even being able to see the beauty of a field even when a couple of people not like you happen to be standing in it?
My little street is pretty mixed and I see everyone hanging out together. Wish I could spread this magic thru the city...
The field is not occupied by "a couple of people standing in it". Have you been to the area? And why do you say that these comments are based on the fact that these folks are "not like us". I think you are making a lot of assumptions here.
I think you can still feel empathy but want to stand up for yourself, your neighbors and your community at the same time.
Seriously I know we've had several shootings within the past month- but overall is crime in Trinidad really that bad over other areas of the city?
Maybe I just happen to live on a quiet block. If thats the case I'm thankful, but I'd also like to help my neighbors acquire the same peace that I find when I go home.
I've had out of town guests several times stay at my house, and was told how peaceful and quiet it was.
Initially I did encounter the john/prostitute in the alley but that have died down after I mentioned the issue on the 5d listserv about 1 year ago. The weather is warming so I'm hoping it doesn't resume.
Anon. 10:06 said, "...focus on the bigger, long term solution: EDUCATION."
Why pour more money into education when you have SOME (emphasis added to reduce comments of being a general racisit) young African Am. boys who don't value education while bullying and ridiculing African American boys that do want to excel in school? Why offer more education when that which is already offered isn't even appreciated? Maybe we're suppose to "Educate" on how to value an education?? This just doesn't make sense to me, but then neither does burning down a black-owned business during a riot. Go figure.
- Privilaged, over-educated, rich (compared to many around me), racist white guy living in "somebody else's" 'hood
I'm a resident of Rosedale and can personally attest to the myriads of problems facing our neighborhood that have nothing to do with Trinidad. But I'd just like to point out two things.
1) The Post seems to have unilaterally dissolved the neighborhood of Kingman Park. Sure, the borders have always been sketchy, but claiming that Rosedale stretches down to Oklahoma is just not right.
2) As someone that regularly hears gun shots and sirens (and calls the police after hearing said gun shots ) it's strange to see that these incidents aren't reported in the crime stats. Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong data, but all I ever see in the crime stats are muggings and car thefts and the occasional assault. I mean, a guy was shot in the head on my corner the night before Halloween and I don't see that in there. I know of three additional shootings just in the past few months, and it's not in there. Maybe there's an explanation...I'd like to here it. Maybe I'm looking at the data incorrectly, or they don't record this in the statistics unless someone dies or only if they press charges...
I have to agree with inked the Washington Post article was way over the top. Yes there are crime areas in Rosedale and there have been shootings. But there are also good neighborhoods in Rosedale. The block that I live on is quiet for the most part. There are two problems houses on the block, but they have been well documented.
Eighty percent of the residents on my block own their homes. The residents in the two problem homes are in the twenty percent that don't own their homes. Go fgure.
poppopbang -- you're not the first person to question the completeness of the crime stats published by the District. They're a frequent source of questions/complaints on the MPD-1D mailing list, for instance.
I live in Rosedale, and can attest to the fact that the article is inaccurate and over the top.
Like dozens of neighborhoods in DC--including Trinidad-- Rosedale has crime. This crime is mostly confined to certain blocks. Obviously, it sucks if you are living on one of those blocks, but to characterize the whole neighborhood that way is just ridiculous.
And to provide no perspective-- i.e. that crime has improved DRAMATICALLY over the years, and a lot of this is because of what Rosedale residents are doing-- is just unfair. This strikes me as just another article written to make people think "oh, those poor people living in the inner city... aren't I glad I'm not one of them."
P.S. As I type this, I am happily sitting at my window enjoying the quiet and beautiful, spring view. I suppose any moment I can expect to be shot through the window.
I'm not so sure that the article is way over the top. It was really shocking to have those guys shooting up and down the street around 4:00 in the afternoon. If Santana had not been hit, there wouldn't have been a crime, as far as the 1st District police are concerned.
There's more to the series, yet, I am Concerned that MPD is blaming Trinidad, and probably combining it with Langston and Carver, as a cause for crime there. We need to find a better way to get 5D and 1 D to work together. I am aware threat they are loosening the boundaries, but there needs to be an effort to combat crime on both sides of the street (Benning Rd.). Do you think a combined special PSA meeting would help?
Mortally dangerous misbehavior by folks "under the influence" is so rare that it's news. Remember Marion Barry's employee who drove the car through the street festival.
By contrast, doesn't most supposedly-drug-related violence stem from the illegal trade? That is, sellers settling scores or establishing turf on the one hand, and buyers rustling up a down payment on the other?
Sellers settle scores by violence because ordinary business practices and law are closed to them. Buyers face extraordinary costs to cover hazard pay for the dealers and lossage at the borders, in addition to the actual product used.
In short, the cause of the violence is that these drugs aren't sold at CVS. Prohibition exacts its revenge.
I find it interesting that the Trinidad folks are so defensive about their neighborhood, as if such a clean name has been unfairly dragged through the mud. I mean, you're living in the neighborhood of Rayful Evans, people. You're delusional if you think you're in anything but one of the most historically crime-ridden parts of DC.
Yes, there is a lot of crime in both neighborhoods-- too much. But things have gotten better. Let's keep working at it-- not get in a ridiculous argument of "my neighborhood is bad but not as bad as your neighborhood."
And Inked, I'd like to see those stats that crime in Trinidad is significantly better than in Rosedale.
It's not that Trinidad is better than Rose, but the crime from up here isn't the cause of the crime down there.
I am tried of my neighborhood being draged through the mud. So Pardon me if i have pride in where I live and work to make it safer. Maybe more down there should do the same.
From reading the above, it would appear turf wars go well beyond drugs...are we really slipping into us vurse them attitude?
Admittedly, I know very little about Trinidad, but I religously read "Frozen Tropics" and by observation, it appears to be much in-line with my neighborhood, Rosedale (though we don't have quite the physical connection/impact to H Street/Benning Rd).
It appears we probably have more in common then not, maybe we could learn from each others' achievements and set-backs.
Ken, I agree. I don't know if one is more dangerous than another. I just know that I am far more familiar with Trinidad, so that probably makes me feel safer here. But we can absolutely learn from each other. It isn't a matter of one neighborhood being somehow better than the other.
i have not seen the specific field in question. I suppose you're saying there are so many people in it that the field itself is not visible because it's so crowded? The question becomes, if the field was filled with, say, a crowd of nice looking folks having a festival that it wouldn't so dramatically affect one's impression of the field. It isn't entirely unreasonable to presume that the TYPE of people crowding the field affected your view of it, rather than the number, but hey, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt next time. I was really conflating the 'empty field = beautiful' comment with the seperate 'puppies-as-children' comparison, two seperate issues by two different posters, if I recall and probably unfit for a single response (should have responded to each one seperately).
speaking of unfit...
As for Hillman, your piling on was unnecessary and added nothing to the discussion.
Chris in Eckington: yes, it was Edmunds-- pardon me. But that's where your knowledge of area history appears to end.
The term you use, "SoFlo" is just a few years old, a product of gentrification. The Orleans area and blocks south of it was long considered the southern part of Trinidad. Any historical account of Rayful will refer to Trinidad as his home base.
Recently, the term "SoFlo" was established, and that squeezed "Trinidad" up to north of Florida. The spot where young Rayful lived was on the eastern end of Orleans, just a block or two south of Florida.
Robby, you say "it's not that Trinidad is better than Rose..."
But if you look at your postings, it's clear that's what you WERE saying. You say that crime in Trinidad is "nothing like Rosedale," and cite Rosedale's "30+ year reputation for violence." No offense, but to hear someone from Trinidad talk that way about another neighborhood is laughable.
You are understandably sensitive about the reputation of your neighborhood, and concerned about stereotyping. But you are doing exactly to Rosedale what you accuse others of doing to Trinidad. Think about it.
I can't beleive I am saying this but I agree with Hillman about Soul Searcher's point. It couldn't be more ridiculous. forget black/white, poor/rich, young/old. If a field is not used as intended by its creation, then the beauty of it is distorted no? if they held a monster truck rally there, it would detract from it just as much as hooligans peddlign their wares and causing mayhem. Don't be ridiculous.
soul searcher- I'm about to get off of field topic but I want to add one thing.
I think you're missing the point. The field and courts around it is metaphorically "beautiful" when it's is used by some people (any people regardless of who these people may be-festival goers or anyone else)who abuse the privilege of having such a space in DC by participating in illegal activities and being extremely disrespectful to the community around them.
seriously, Rosedale goes all the way to 14th St on the western border? I've lived on 14th Place for almost 5 years and I had no idea I was living in Rosedale. Is the Post correct on their boundaries?
42 comments:
"Assistant Police Chief Diane Groomes blamed a spillover of trouble from the nearby Trinidad neighborhood and said that police patrols have increased."
Wow, my Dad lived on 15th Street in the 60s, and remembers Rosedale and Gails being horrible even back then. To blame this on spillover from Trinidad is really unfortunate. Trinidad has it's problems, but Rosedale is kinda where we were a few years ago. There is still higher than I would like it crime here, but it's nothing like Rosedale up here however, and I live in not so spruced up sections of Trinidad.
Maybe I am being protective of my neighborhood, and so I took offense to the statement. Rosedale and Trinidad barely share a boarder. Trinidad is north of Florida, south of Mt. Olivet West of Bladensburg's Road, East of West Virginia. The only way to get there from Trinidad would be to run diagonally from the Delta Towers to the Pentacle. I am sure the rash of violence isn't caused by gun toting senior citizens.
I know long time residents who won’t even set foot in Rosedale because of its long standing, 30+ year, and reputation for violence.
The Violence down there isn't new, and I take issues with the City’s pin the tail on the donkey strategy, of blaming Trinidad for Rosedale's recent spike in crime.
-RobbyCU
Rosedale could be the next fretted about neighborhood that the Post takes up, without having reporters cross the river.
The article is way over the top. I took the spillover comment from Groomes to be a reference to the fact that certain guys from both Trinidad and Langston who in that sort of life tend to have a rivalry with similar guys from Rosedale and those conflicts often seem to play out violently in Rosedale. My perception is that crime is higher in Rosedale than in most, if not all, of Trinidad, but I'd have to check the stats.
At any rate, I don't think the article is even close to an accurate portrayal of the overall situation in Rosedale. Another fine Post offering where the reporter had a story already written in her head and then sought out quotes and facts to support that article while ignoring anything that contradicts it.
yet another article by the post that portrays the black community as a war zone. they make it seem like rosedale is right up there with haiti. eh, that's mass media for 'ya.
I moved to Trinidad a few years ago and I cannot wait to move out in a few months. The violence in Trinidad and Rosedale is just absurd. It amazes me that just a few (hundred) rotten apples can really spoil an entire neighborhood.
I'm just curious as to why this article is so "over the top". I do not agree that the problems are a result of "spillover" from Trinidad.
It does feel as if Rosedale is a "war zone" as times and nothing is being done about it. Maybe this article can bring some of the issues (such as the gigantic problem with the rec center)to the attention of someone who will pay attention.
For me the violence isn't the biggest issue, it's the number of crazy drugged out crack (and other drug) addicts running around, making life very unpleasant for the rest of us, especially with their hysterical screaming at 3am. And the police are VERY jaded, perhaps to the point of being ineffective. When I moved to the neighborhood people pointed out where the local crack dealer lives- with her many children. I went to a district police meeting in February, and the cops nonchalantly pointed out which apartment complex you go to to get different drugs. For you Frozen Tropics readers who are interested, Pentacle is where you go to get your pot, The one where the girl was shot (I forget the name) is where you pick up your crack, and all of your PCP needs are met at Benning Court.
The day after two people high on PCP were being held on the ground on the street in front of my house a month ago, I asked a patrol office if he'd heard about the incident. He hadn't, and then he added, "That's when you know summer is here!"
Nice.
MCC: I doesn't seem like Rosedale is a war zone to me. It just seems like a neighborhood with kids running amok- like hundreds of puppies off their leashes with no supervision.
The rec center itself isn't a problem, it's the dozens of kids hanging out there unsupervised, with nothing to do, at all hours of the night. Someday- in 5 years or so, there will be a new rec center, and the grounds will probably be locked up at night.
MCC, Rosedale does have violence problems. I'm not denying that. What I'm saying is that there is more to the neighborhood and the article totally ignores that except for as brief mention of Cafe Roma. And then it thrusts the story straight back into shooting gallery mode with that final quote. I'm just saying the author here is hamming it up more than a little, and I don't think the overall picture is very accurate. I don't think the typical resident is moving their beds away from the windows for fear of stray bullets.
My favorite quote has to be “When Rosedale residents get together, the talk is of the latest gun battle, the police helicopter searchlights that disturbed the past night's sleep, the neighbor who barely escaped tragedy.“ Seriously? Those are the most common topics of conversation? I don't think so.
The trinidad area for as long as anyone can remember has always been dangerous and filled with crack heads. Community members need to stop wasting their time trying to figure out how to stop all the criminal activity going on and focus on the bigger, long term solution: EDUCATION. As long as eduction is not there, you can expect to see this going on forever, or at least until the yuppies take over the neighborhood.
Some might argue that it's the parents' fault, not the education. Well, the parents who're selling crack and have 6 kids probably didn't have an education either, which is why they are where they are right now.
Inked- FYI: The last conversation I had with my neighbors was about the amazing meal I had at Langston Bar and Grill- also in Rosedale/Kingman Park. It was perhaps the best roast chicken I've ever had!
Do you not think that drugs lead to violence?
Violence doesn't always have to come in the form of someone getting shot (although that does happen in this neighborhood)-what able people getting harassed and beaten?
The rec center is a problem because it is a shell of a building with no supervision present. It provides benches, stoops and various other places for people to do their drugs with some shelter. And yes, I can point out where the crack dealers live as well-so why do the police not stop this?
The young children who actually try to play on the playground have to deal with crack bags, knives, liquor bottles and people who should not be there.
It's a central meeting places for children (and adults) who have nothing else to do to but hang out-yet there are no activities, rules or control. The basketball courts are a 24 hour scream fest.
These folks who use the rec center as a hang out intimidate the entire neighborhood all hours of the night. It could be used as a resource for this community but is not, at all.
inked-Yes, I do think when neighbors get together that a first topic of conversation may be what is happening in that neighborhood as far as crime and violence. I live directly across from the rec center and it seems like there is always something to be concerned about. The neighbors look out for each and this is one way to do that.
There is more to the neighborhood, I agree. I love it there! But it also scares me at times. I didn't see the article as trying to encompass all that the neighborhood is but trying to point out a problem.
mcc: I feel your pain if you live across from the rec center! I often walk my dog at the rec center. We're meeting another dog there tomorrow morning at 7am if you want to come say hello! The field is beautiful when it's deserted!
Thanks Tom. I do agree-it absolutely
peaceful and beautiful in the early morning.
I have dogs as well. If I have the time I'll step over. If not-another time for sure.
And I do want to add that I think this is an important string of conversation because I do wonder if the problems in this area are really being paid attention to.
i have been going to many of the psa 103 meetings since I moved to rosedale 2 and half years ago and the commanders frequently blame crimes in our hood as being the result of spillover from Trinidad. It always struck me as a bit glib and self serving as if rosedale doesn't have its own share of home grown knuckleheads. Over a year ago residents including myself along the 16th street corridor began complaining about a noticeable uptick in violence and suspicious activity along the stretches of 15th, 16th, and 17th streets from gales down south to c street. The police response was dismissive, pointing to outdated statistics showing crime is down, ignoring the pleas of residents who repeatedly pointed out incidents of crime or would-be crime that were unlikely to show up in the stats. It wasn't until the shootouts this spring (one of which the post story referenced) before the police presence and response was increased in the area. this more than anything else is a big part of why I will likely leave this neighborhood.
the field is beautiful when it's deserted?
comparing children to puppies?
sigh.
I'm not saying we all have to love each other, but can we get a bit of empathy, on the level of "those kids could be my kids if I were in different circumstances" or even being able to see the beauty of a field even when a couple of people not like you happen to be standing in it?
My little street is pretty mixed and I see everyone hanging out together. Wish I could spread this magic thru the city...
The field is not occupied by "a couple of people standing in it". Have you been to the area? And why do you say that these comments are based on the fact that these folks are "not like us". I think you are making a lot of assumptions here.
I think you can still feel empathy but want to stand up for yourself, your neighbors and your community at the same time.
Seriously I know we've had several shootings within the past month- but overall is crime in Trinidad really that bad over other areas of the city?
Maybe I just happen to live on a quiet block. If thats the case I'm thankful, but I'd also like to help my neighbors acquire the same peace that I find when I go home.
I've had out of town guests several times stay at my house, and was told how peaceful and quiet it was.
Initially I did encounter the john/prostitute in the alley but that have died down after I mentioned the issue on the 5d listserv about 1 year ago. The weather is warming so I'm hoping it doesn't resume.
Trinidad Home Owner.
Anon. 10:06 said, "...focus on the bigger, long term solution: EDUCATION."
Why pour more money into education when you have SOME (emphasis added to reduce comments of being a general racisit) young African Am. boys who don't value education while bullying and ridiculing African American boys that do want to excel in school? Why offer more education when that which is already offered isn't even appreciated? Maybe we're suppose to "Educate" on how to value an education?? This just doesn't make sense to me, but then neither does burning down a black-owned business during a riot. Go figure.
- Privilaged, over-educated, rich (compared to many around me), racist white guy living in "somebody else's" 'hood
I'm a resident of Rosedale and can personally attest to the myriads of problems facing our neighborhood that have nothing to do with Trinidad. But I'd just like to point out two things.
1) The Post seems to have unilaterally dissolved the neighborhood of Kingman Park. Sure, the borders have always been sketchy, but claiming that Rosedale stretches down to Oklahoma is just not right.
2) As someone that regularly hears gun shots and sirens (and calls the police after hearing said gun shots ) it's strange to see that these incidents aren't reported in the crime stats. Maybe I'm just looking at the wrong data, but all I ever see in the crime stats are muggings and car thefts and the occasional assault. I mean, a guy was shot in the head on my corner the night before Halloween and I don't see that in there. I know of three additional shootings just in the past few months, and it's not in there. Maybe there's an explanation...I'd like to here it. Maybe I'm looking at the data incorrectly, or they don't record this in the statistics unless someone dies or only if they press charges...
I have to agree with inked the Washington Post article was way over the top. Yes there are crime areas in Rosedale and there have been shootings. But there are also good neighborhoods in Rosedale. The block that I live on is quiet for the most part. There are two problems houses on the block, but they have been well documented.
Eighty percent of the residents on my block own their homes. The residents in the two problem homes are in the twenty percent that don't own their homes. Go fgure.
poppopbang -- you're not the first person to question the completeness of the crime stats published by the District. They're a frequent source of questions/complaints on the MPD-1D mailing list, for instance.
I live in Rosedale, and can attest to the fact that the article is inaccurate and over the top.
Like dozens of neighborhoods in DC--including Trinidad-- Rosedale has crime. This crime is mostly confined to certain blocks. Obviously, it sucks if you are living on one of those blocks, but to characterize the whole neighborhood that way is just ridiculous.
And to provide no perspective-- i.e. that crime has improved DRAMATICALLY over the years, and a lot of this is because of what Rosedale residents are doing-- is just unfair. This strikes me as just another article written to make people think "oh, those poor people living in the inner city... aren't I glad I'm not one of them."
P.S. As I type this, I am happily sitting at my window enjoying the quiet and beautiful, spring view. I suppose any moment I can expect to be shot through the window.
I'm not so sure that the article is way over the top. It was really shocking to have those guys shooting up and down the street around 4:00 in the afternoon. If Santana had not been hit, there wouldn't have been a crime, as far as the 1st District police are concerned.
There's more to the series, yet, I am Concerned that MPD is blaming Trinidad, and probably combining it with Langston and Carver, as a cause for crime there. We need to find a better way to get 5D and 1 D to work together. I am aware threat they are loosening the boundaries, but there needs to be an effort to combat crime on both sides of the street (Benning Rd.). Do you think a combined special PSA meeting would help?
Mortally dangerous misbehavior by folks "under the influence" is so rare that it's news. Remember Marion Barry's employee who drove the car through the street festival.
By contrast, doesn't most supposedly-drug-related violence stem from the illegal trade? That is, sellers settling scores or establishing turf on the one hand, and buyers rustling up a down payment on the other?
Sellers settle scores by violence because ordinary business practices and law are closed to them. Buyers face extraordinary costs to cover hazard pay for the dealers and lossage at the borders, in addition to the actual product used.
In short, the cause of the violence is that these drugs aren't sold at CVS. Prohibition exacts its revenge.
"even being able to see the beauty of a field even when a couple of people not like you happen to be standing in it?"
Quite the presumptive load of nonsense.
But I guess that's easier than actually tackling the roots of the problem, eh?
I find it interesting that the Trinidad folks are so defensive about their neighborhood, as if such a clean name has been unfairly dragged through the mud. I mean, you're living in the neighborhood of Rayful Evans, people. You're delusional if you think you're in anything but one of the most historically crime-ridden parts of DC.
Yes, there is a lot of crime in both neighborhoods-- too much. But things have gotten better. Let's keep working at it-- not get in a ridiculous argument of "my neighborhood is bad but not as bad as your neighborhood."
And Inked, I'd like to see those stats that crime in Trinidad is significantly better than in Rosedale.
It's not that Trinidad is better than Rose, but the crime from up here isn't the cause of the crime down there.
I am tried of my neighborhood being draged through the mud. So Pardon me if i have pride in where I live and work to make it safer. Maybe more down there should do the same.
-Robby
Thanks, Robby. It never occurred to me to try to make my neighborhood safer. I'll look into that. :)
From reading the above, it would appear turf wars go well beyond drugs...are we really slipping into us vurse them attitude?
Admittedly, I know very little about Trinidad, but I religously read "Frozen Tropics" and by observation, it appears to be much in-line with my neighborhood, Rosedale (though we don't have quite the physical connection/impact to H Street/Benning Rd).
It appears we probably have more in common then not, maybe we could learn from each others' achievements and set-backs.
Ken
Ken, I agree. I don't know if one is more dangerous than another. I just know that I am far more familiar with Trinidad, so that probably makes me feel safer here. But we can absolutely learn from each other. It isn't a matter of one neighborhood being somehow better than the other.
hill east bloggers for life!!
just thought i'd jump into the blogger "turf war"
Anon 10:43 pm: it's Rayful Edmond and he was dealing out of Near Northeast aka SoFlo aka North Capitol Hill (Orleans place to be exact).
mcc,
i have not seen the specific field in question. I suppose you're saying there are so many people in it that the field itself is not visible because it's so crowded? The question becomes, if the field was filled with, say, a crowd of nice looking folks having a festival that it wouldn't so dramatically affect one's impression of the field. It isn't entirely unreasonable to presume that the TYPE of people crowding the field affected your view of it, rather than the number, but hey, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt next time. I was really conflating the 'empty field = beautiful' comment with the seperate 'puppies-as-children' comparison, two seperate issues by two different posters, if I recall and probably unfit for a single response (should have responded to each one seperately).
speaking of unfit...
As for Hillman, your piling on was unnecessary and added nothing to the discussion.
Chris in Eckington: yes, it was Edmunds-- pardon me. But that's where your knowledge of area history appears to end.
The term you use, "SoFlo" is just a few years old, a product of gentrification. The Orleans area and blocks south of it was long considered the southern part of Trinidad. Any historical account of Rayful will refer to Trinidad as his home base.
Recently, the term "SoFlo" was established, and that squeezed "Trinidad" up to north of Florida. The spot where young Rayful lived was on the eastern end of Orleans, just a block or two south of Florida.
Robby, you say "it's not that Trinidad is better than Rose..."
But if you look at your postings, it's clear that's what you WERE saying. You say that crime in Trinidad is "nothing like Rosedale," and cite Rosedale's "30+ year reputation for violence." No offense, but to hear someone from Trinidad talk that way about another neighborhood is laughable.
You are understandably sensitive about the reputation of your neighborhood, and concerned about stereotyping. But you are doing exactly to Rosedale what you accuse others of doing to Trinidad. Think about it.
I can't beleive I am saying this but I agree with Hillman about Soul Searcher's point. It couldn't be more ridiculous. forget black/white, poor/rich, young/old. If a field is not used as intended by its creation, then the beauty of it is distorted no? if they held a monster truck rally there, it would detract from it just as much as hooligans peddlign their wares and causing mayhem. Don't be ridiculous.
soul searcher-
I'm about to get off of field topic but I want to add one thing.
I think you're missing the point. The field and courts around it is metaphorically "beautiful" when it's is used by some people (any people regardless of who these people may be-festival goers or anyone else)who abuse the privilege of having such a space in DC by participating in illegal activities and being extremely disrespectful to the community around them.
It's the abuse that is the problem.
Unfortunately Soul Searcher continues to find racism where it doesn't even exist.
seriously, Rosedale goes all the way to 14th St on the western border? I've lived on 14th Place for almost 5 years and I had no idea I was living in Rosedale. Is the Post correct on their boundaries?
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