The New York Times has an interesting piece on one community and the controversy that has erupted over housing choice vouchers, those who use them, and the reaction among some others in the community.
Here's a related link from We are Respectable Negroes.
Here's American Murder Mystery from the Atlantic Monthly, and here is Who Dun It in the American Murder Mystery? from Rooflines [published by the National Housing Institute]. Also worth a read is Memphis Murder Mystery? No, Just Mistaken Identity from Shelter Force.
34 comments:
Great article. Poverty is a national problem, so it should be spread out! If more upper class people have to see it, more will probably be done about it. When I first started taking the x2 bus, after using a different, and quite pleasant bus route in the city for a year, I was shocked at how crowded it was, and that the people just accepted the horrible conditions. If the X2 were in a more affluent neighborhood in DC, no one would put up with it, and there would be "express routes" already. Part of my deciding to buy in the neighborhood was my enjoyment of the DC bus system. I should have tried to commute on the X2 first!
Ok, rant over.
The X2 can be awful. I think the worst problem is overcrowding on the bus. We need to be proactive - make Metro aware of the problem and force action on their part. We need to (politely) demand action from Metro to resolve these problems. The X2 is the lifeline to the H Street community. In order to bring more people into the community, they need to be able get here.
Tom - very timely comment as I finally submitted a complaint to Metro this morning after waiting 30 minutes for an X2 after two full buses went by without stopping, which is not unusual. I've only been in the area for a couple months but I'm already fed up with the overcrowding and inconsistent service no matter the time of day. In my previous neighborhood (Glover Park) the bus lines had plenty of issues but I did feel like residents were more active about reporting the issues to Metro. You would frequently see Metro supervisors in the area checking up on buses so you at least got the sense they were aware of the problems and were trying to fix them. I have never seen any supervisors on H street inspecting the X2 route. I will say that you hear plenty of people on the X2 complain about the conditions, but maybe they don't know where to voice those complaints or feel like nothing will change even if they do call or write Metro.
I've been riding the X2 for five years and the scheduling/overcrowding problem has grown much worse during the last six months.
Perhaps high fuel prices are boosting ridership. The X2 is one of the busiest routes in the city, and as such, Metro should take care of its best customers.
You can contact Metro by mail or online (though I've never received a reply from my online submissions).
Better yet, pen a missive directly to the Big Guy or a board member .
Yes, it was tolerable when I first moved to the area in the fall, but I've given up on the X2 in the past couple of months. I now walk 20 minutes to the Stadium, and it takes less time to get to work. I got sick of calling to complain about the X2. Once, when I asked a driver about the short buses, she told me that the drivers just grab the next available bus based on when their shift starts, regardless of their actual routes.
from the article:
Sociologists have long claimed that leaving behind high-crime, low-employment neighborhoods for the middle-class suburbs buoys the fortunes of impoverished tenants. An article in the July/August edition of The Atlantic Monthly, however, cited findings by researchers at the University of Memphis that crime in Memphis appeared to migrate with voucher recipients.
What's here to justify the "however"? These two data points seem to be perfectly compatible.
Folks who migrate from super high-density public housing to housing in the suburbs, do better where they're surrounded by a more functional environment.
At the same time, crime in the areas Section 8 folks move to show an uptick in crime.
I'd be interested to know whether crime *overall* was reduced.
I did rent my NE/Trinidad home to Section 8 tenants. I am a black female, I was not in foreclosure and I did still live in the basement of the home until recently. It has been a nightmare. There are several homes on my block with absentee landlords that have rented to section 8 and the Section 8 tenants have made the block a living hell. My tenant who, upon interviewing was as sweet as pie, was supposed to move in with her three little girls and her husband (turns out there isn't a marriage license at all). This woman ended up moving in her mother, sister and baby and two brothers. I had ten people living above me using electricity, water and gas, which I paid for. I am still behind on those bills and Section 8 is not willing to give her a voucher for utilities. She "lost" her job not long after moving in and that's when the real hell began. Late night parties until 4:00 am w/ weed smoke coming through the vents thick enough to choke an elephant, fights outside on my front stoop, trash overflowing in my backyard and no one wanting to take it to the curb. You don't have enough space to contain my entire ordeal. Let's just say there is also some interest into my tenants source of income. I am finally moving out and hoping to sell the property or convince my ex to buy me out. While I am considered quite the liberal, Section 8 was not for me and will never be recommended by me.
I've thought about the X2 problem and I think we need to convince the council members through whose districts the X2 travels to take it up as a political issue as election day nears. Metro would be a convenient rhetorical punching bag for them it seems and maybe their railing against bad conditions on X2 would actually have some effect.
So it would be interesting to see if crime *drops* by the same percentages as Section 8 housing decreases in Trinidad.
Section 8 is a state of mind and lifestyle for most (sadly) rather than a safety net.
-SG
Just to throw my 2 cents in, the Section 8 program is yet another example of a well-intentioned government program with unintended consequences (but aren't they all?).
I've dealt with this as an affordable housing developer, and while I can say that some of these folks are decent people, a very large percentage are people whose lifestyle, family, and friends are a total nuisance to neighbors. Landlords like them on one hand because the gov't is picking up most of the tab (and you charge the gov't the prevailing market rent, even if you couldn't possibly get that for the location) and you get the payments more or less like clockwork. On the other hand, Sec 8 tenants as a general rule are going to wreck the place, so it will cost you when they finally move out and you want to get someone else in there.
Last but not least you have DC's insanely tenant-friendly laws, so if you get stuck with a real bum, it's tough to get rid of them, so you and the surrounding residents suffer.
But if you are a landlord and aren't living there, why would you care if you have miserable tenants that are a nuisance to your neighbors?
Can't you just continue renting to Section 8 family (or extended family typically) after Section 8 familiy in perpetuity? What reason would you have not to?
Living next to a Section 8 house is a pretty trying ordeal. Even if they aren't drug addicts or violent (a stereotype reinforced all too often), the place is often filthy, loud and dangerously unkempt (maybe this last one is a landlord problem but, again, why put in effort if you don't have to??).
Can you contact the government and ask that someone's Section 8 license (or whatever permission you need to have such a thing) get taken away? Is there any recourse at all?
As our section of NE continues to improve (albeit slowly), fewer of such houses would certainly benefit the neighborhood. But if you are going to be able to get market rent through government subsidy, and piling as many possible people to make up the difference, where's the incentive for redevelopment, maintenance, and general tenant-quality screening?
yeah, since i have rather problematic tenants, here is the law on section 8 tenants. Also, you can also document the problems and sue the landlord and tenant for damages... which I may do.
http://www.nhlp.org/html/pubhsg/onestrike.htm
In regards to Section 8 tenant-based housing (Vouchers and
Certificates), the language of the statute is slightly different. The
statute requires Section 8 Housing Assistance Payment Contracts to
provide that:
during the term of the lease, any criminal activity that threatens
the health, safety, or right to peaceful enjoyment of the premises by
other tenant, any criminal activity that threatens the health, safety,
or right to peaceful enjoyment of their residences by persons residing
in the immediate vicinity of the premises, [or any violent](23) or any
drug-related criminal activity on or near such premises, engaged in by
a tenant of any unit, any member of the tenant's household, or any
guest or other person under the tenant's control, shall be cause for
termination of tenancy. . . .(24)
The major difference between the public housing statute and the
tenant-based Section 8 statute is the language on location of the
activity. One provides for "on or near" and the other "on or off."
err... in my last comment, i meant that I have problematic neighbors, not tenants.
DCJaded:
Good luck with that lawsuit. No DC jury is going to award you anything with regard to the tenants, period. And as far as the landlord goes, any decent lawyer can successfully argue that the DC landlord/tenant laws make it nearly impossible to evict problem tenants or to control their behavior to any meaningful degree.
Even if a landlord can prove drug use in the apartment, it can take years to actually get the person evicted.
As for being noisy, dirty, etc., that's pretty much a lost cause, as far as grounds for eviction.
I'm not saying it's right. I'm saying that's how it is.
Plus, of course, you'd have to show that you actually tried to resolve the problem..... calling the police, talking to the tenants to express your concerns, notifying the landlord of the problems after having tried to work them out with the tenants, etc.
I'm assuming you've taken all those steps?
I'm also wondering if you contemplate lawsuits against problem neighbors that don't happen to have a landlord handy for you to sue.
I've seen these articles before.
It reinforces the idea that this is a cultural thing. We must deal with the cultural issues involved here.
Unfortunately it looks like not enough time has passed to do studies showing the effects long term. That is, what long term impact does good schools, a suburban atmosphere, etc., have on the children of these newly relocated people?
Regardless, the alternative is to continue warehousing them in high crime ghettos, and that is unacceptable.
hillman said it's cultural. I'd say sociological. The chapter on use value of place in _Urban Fortunes_ is pretty key in understanding the issues involved in place and SES. The failure was the belief that the negative conditions only derived from being located in the "faulty" place, hence the moving of people to unfaulty places. But the behavior is a function in part of SES, which didn't change.
What is SES?
Richard:
I can't disagree with your clarification. Perhaps I use cultural and sociological interchangeably when they aren't actually the same thing.
Jaded:
The last paragraph in my response to you was perhaps a bit snippy, which wasn't my intent.
I was just curious as to why you would consider suing the landlord, and wondering if you would consider suing an owner-occupant for the same sorts of problems.
Socio-Economic Status.
Just because you take a person out of one neighborhood and plop them into a middle-class suburban environment doesn't mean that they shed behavior that keeps them either poor or prone to trouble with the law. I don't know how you change that, since most people act up or down to the expections placed on them by people whose esteem they value - usually friends and family moreso than new middle-class neighbors.
Another Section 8 fun fact (according to one of my property managers): you can actually inherit a voucher if the primary leaseholder dies and you are a member of the household. While on its face this sounds sensible, what often happens is that the leaseholder puts a family member - like an adult child that doesn't actually live there - on the lease so when they die it passes onto a person that didn't go through the regular application and waiting period. We had a wheelchair-bound woman refuse to move to a brand-new handicap accessible unit for this reason - the HC unit was in a rent-subsidized unit that would have meant giving up the voucher (although keeping basically the same rent) because she wanted to make sure her youngest daughter that lives in a different county would get her voucher. I couldn't believe this, but I guess the property management company has encountered this before.
7th Street
I thought a "Section 8" was that thing Corporal Klinger was always trying to get on M.A.S.H. so he could go back to Toledo.
It's disheartening that so many good hard working people don't get involved in the community, so all we see is the "trouble." When I asked a neighbor who I've still yet to actually meet, earlier this summer if she was going to attend a neighborhood picnic, she said, "Oh no, I just come home and lock my doors." So despite all the drug addicts and kids running around, there IS that silent invisible majority of people in their houses who aren't interested in going outside at all.
And until parents realize it's not a good idea to let their 12 year old sons (and daughters to a lesser degree) run around the streets all night, we're going to have continuing crime, drugs, and poverty in our neighborhoods. You can't really blame the system very much at all. I'd love to see the curfew enforced, with kids under a certain age being brought somewhere (maybe even some sort of supervised late night activity center) until picked up by a parent.
Tom - that is exactly the procedure. Kids that break curfew are brought to a Rec Center until a parent picks them up.
MPD Curfew Law - Know the Facts
Now, as for how often kids actually get picked up for breaking curfew, that I don't know.
Just because you take a person out of one neighborhood and plop them into a middle-class suburban environment doesn't mean that they shed behavior that keeps them either poor or prone to trouble with the law.
Absolutely true; but there is a multiplier effect when you keep a large number of "troubled" families cooped up together in a ghetto that you don't get when they're dispersed.
IBC - I agree that it's much worse when you have people like this tightly clustered, but even one family like this in a building or neighborhood can be a big drag on the surrounding neighbors.
In my experience (granted, all multifamily) you can have an otherwise great building quickly go downhill when there is one bad unit. People are simply too intimidated most of the time to either bring the issue to management or confront their neighbors directly with their problems. Even without the multiplier effect you mention, it makes life very unpleasant for the neighbors and affects other folks' quality of life. I can't blame anybody for not wanting to have a Section 8 family living next door.
7th Street
Even without the multiplier effect you mention, it makes life very unpleasant for the neighbors and affects other folks' quality of life. I can't blame anybody for not wanting to have a Section 8 family living next door.
Right, I guess I was looking at it from the perspective of a city-dweller: the article was about the rise of Section 8 housing in the 'burbs. I was taking issue with the tone of equivocal way the author pointed out that there are more opportunities in the 'burbs, but then "on-the-other-handed" this point by saying that there's a rise in suburban crime.
Of course, the question is: is the sum total of crime throughout the region reduced by dispersing Section 8 housing throughout the suburbs rather than concentrating it in the urban core. Seems that the answer is "yes".
Leaving aside the problems this brings to suburban communities, we're definitely better off as a city--and as a *region*--with Section 8 housing vouchers encouraging dysfunctional families to flee the city for suburbia. We can concentrate our "affordable housing" efforts on getting housing for teachers, police officers, firemen, the families of national merit scholars, whatever...
Considering DC and other urban municipalities have been bearing an unfair burden for the last 4-5 decades, I think maybe it's time for the same suburbanites who've been chastising the District for failing to cure all the ills of the world to have the chance to fix things....
It's a win-win for everybody!
I think the idea of Section 8 is that by placing them in a more diverse neighborhood with people of a higher SES, they will have a greater chance of developing associations with those people and have a greater chance of changing their SES. But as some of the other posters have indicated, at the end of the day, the section 8 people have to make the change from within.
I'm a bit mortified by how acceptable it seems to be to denigrate people simply because they are Section 8 voucher holders. Voucher holders run the gamut of society just as financially wealthy individuals do. Those of us who inherit privilege should not use our political and economic power to exclude and demean those who inherited a legacy of disenfranchisement. Please consider applying your energies toward initiatives that are positive, inclusive and compassionate.
I'm a bit mortified by how acceptable it seems to be to denigrate people simply because they are Section 8 voucher holders. Voucher holders run the gamut of society just as financially wealthy individuals do.
Not sure what you're referring to by "denigrate". Most of the comments involved what the best way to get people back on their feet. The one thing all Section 8 voucher holders have in common is that they are incapable of keeping a roof over their heads. Seems to me the least we can do is talk about ways to end the cycle of poverty.
I know if my younger brother came to me with his hand out asking for rent money at the end of every month, I'd have every right in the world to attach conditions to the money. Heck, I'd consider it an obligation.
"Those of us who inherit privilege should not use our political and economic power to exclude and demean those who inherited a legacy of disenfranchisement."
Don't assume we all 'inherit privilege'.
I for one was born dirt poor, with far less opportunity than the 'poor' in DC today.
I would like to point out that, in my case at least, it is numerous residents that want the people out. In fact people on my street who have section 8 housing want these people out. I dont care if they are Section 8 or not. These residents have forced out 2 other people on the block because they couldnt deal with the noise, trash and danger resulting from the bad tenants.
Wow...I"m up at 5ish in the am b/c I'm craving ice cream. Then I get to read the blog and this is better than the Olympics!
The plight of the urban poor with respect to the housing shortage is inextricably linked to crime.
We see it in Trinidad with the 13year's murder and the 3 young men who were killed.
It takes more than just rhetoric in a blog. It takes social action and a willingness to collectively unite and say "No" to social malaise that oozes from the proliferation of greed that stems from the lack of commitment to our community-Trinidad. Trinidad is made of upper, middle & lower income folks. And, frankly, we need to take it back! If we know that the Section 8 property owner has no interest in building the neighborhood, then we need to COLLECTIVELY sue them through a class action lawsuit. Make them work for the little money that they get a month. We also need to hold the politicos accountable. They come in for a quick soundbite and then get back into their limos and ride away.
What about the lost dream of the child, of the young men? What about them?
It's more than just home equity, a monthly ROI.
Let's take our community back so we can all live with less nuisance and fear.
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