A look at what's going on in Trinidad, on H Street, and in the larger area north of Capitol Hill.
Thursday, June 07, 2007
WP: Clubs & Ward 5
Here's a Post piece discussing the outcome of the closely watched initial vote on legislation regarding the relocation of various adult clubs displaced by the baseball stadium development and the eminent domain at Skyland.
37 comments:
Anonymous
said...
lame.
lame.
lame.
these clubs should sense the opposition to their relocation, and respect it.
the communities are probably really going to harass the clubs' patrons now that they got this cushy little deal.
whenever you force something through (when it's not wanted), you are BEGGING for trouble.
It seems that the compromise is at least equitable in the distribution of the clubs through each ward. In a perfect world, there could be an intersection between these clubs and other businesses that would create a vibrant atmosphere for everyone to enjoy. M St NW and Conn ave come to mind.
my point is that in the old days when the clubs went into that area, nobody cared, because no one cared about the area.
in 2007, people are actually very much articulate about how they feel about the clubs moving into the area. I HOPE that doesn't spell trouble, but if you look at similar examples, the possibility does indeed exist.
Understood on the private rooms, just trying to look at the potential upside of the economic development, and mixed use area. My guess is that these types of clubs will be displaced again, when the NY Ave area is ready to be fully developed.
palace: i dig what you say, but the fact is that a huge project is way past the purchase/planning stages, and it's right across the street.
here's an old planning link: http://planning.dc.gov/planning/frames.asp?doc=/planning/lib/planning/project/ne_corridor/pdf/northeast_gateway_summary.pdf
and the other huge residential/retail/office complex across the street is called Washington Gateway (by ABDO, i think). someone posted the link to that recently on this blog.
the worry is that these places are going to interrupt stuff that has been being planned for years, and is months away from actually breaking ground.
If you really are encouraging harassment of club patrons, prepare for them to fight back. The day of gay bar patrons allowing neighborhood residents to pester them is long over.
Anon 1:56-I suggested an alternate outcome in a previous post...what if the Abdo & other development go forward and the clubs' owners sell out because their property values go up? Like happened to some of them in the stadium area. Seems like that could happen as well. Sound realistic? Some people have suggested that the locations might be better as grocery stores or other things...maybe a chain would offer to buy the property at a price that would tempt the club owner(s). BTW: I'm not advocating this...just speculating about what might happen.
I am sure this is more than a possibility. One owner has sunk nearly 5 million on two buildings. If development comes in, and buys him out at a price, he/she has the ability to bank on their real estate, operate for the 2+ years for the developments to begin, and then get a deal for the next "undesireable"* neighborhood that is available.
strip clubs right next to a very cool and up and coming area is just not cool.
gay or straight.
selling dildos or pocket pussies.
just not cool, in this area.
in the seventies, you didn't have onlline porn. now you do. it's safer than these ramshackle establishments, and will likely prevail.
for some of you folks on this site, most of which i assume are transplants from other states in the U.S., you may think this is open territory for your little fetishes. it's not. open one of these places near your mom's or dad's house in iowa (etc.) and see how you feel about that.
you're probably not going to like it.
well, this is a city of residents too.
and the area in which little closed sex booths want to open is in an up and coming residential area.
ain't gonna happen.
even if it does, it's gonna fail.
there are too many educated people that care about real estate value to give a rat's butt about some losers watching another loser shake their booty.
go online.
much better variety, and less risk.
these places are doomed, particularly in this area.
everyone thinks it's a crap area that no one cares about. not true.
SE was a crap area that no one cared about, that's why the strip clubs moved there in the 70's.
this is not at all like that area.
folks have invested billions, yes BILLIONS in the area.
the little fetish clubs will survive for a while, but if you were really a big advocate about having long term gay/strip/sex clubs, you'd obviously look for another place.
there are areas farther north, and in anacostia that would keep you there for a while.
watch where the other club owners will be relocating. it isn't nearby.
you are delaying development, and filling the pockets of a bunch of folks that just want to make money. most of the club owners, by the way, are straight.
they're just looking to fill their pockets, while the gay folk sit around and claim discrimination, and probably would never frequent those clubs if they move, right hilldude?
they move, they make money, and everyone else that lives around the area gets angry if they live near, or doesn't care, if they live farther out - like hillman.
he's full of crap, and just wants to elicit the bigotry argument to justify some issues he thinks are prevalent in society. it makes an old queen feel like he's doing something.
wake up, dude. it's a different era.
arguing about relocating the clubs that you will not frequent, and not living by them, will not make your hair grow back, and it won't give you that ever so sexy six-pack.
get over it.
look after the interests of the whole city, not your personal issues.
go live in tijuana or thailand if you feel so strongly about screwing average citizens out of a possibly 'nice' neighborhood.
this is washington, dc, and we won't tolerate a bunch of loser places in one of the last places that average americans can still think about living the american dream. think "owning a house" where you can accumulate equity, sleep at night, etc.
if you want to watch naked people (gay or straight) call verizon and surf online for your little fetish.
don't bring a bunch of crap to an area where people actually want to create a home.
the issue is so slanted, it's sick.
it's not about homophobia. it's about creating a monumental city.
which, apparently, you aren't too keen on doing.
i seriously see the supporting folks moving outta here soon.
dc is not the place for private dancing rooms.
MD or VA is better suited for you.
you can't have it all, strip club supporters. and you won't.
i swear that i'm going to open a strip club in hillman's neighborhood, and see what he says.
will he be supportive of it?
only if it's a gay club.
and even then, i doubt he'd be organizing rallies to make it happen.
hillman, do you think all straight people are homophobic or something? You seem to infer that a lot. Because to me that seems a little like stereotyping straight people...
If you are not please say so, I'm just trying to clarify.
I'm only going to say you've got a lot of hate and anger going on, and that's not really what neighborhood online forums are for. And I agree with Chris, you need to man up and sign your name to a post like that.
In fact, this entire forum would be well served if the ability to post as Anonymous was done away with. It's especially confusing where there are multiple people claiming to be Anonymous in the same chat.
Roy: I've gone out of my way to say not all opposition to clubs is homophobia. I've said that numerous times.
I simply asked you to provide the statistics that you claim exist that say that grouping strip clubs together causes more crime. You are the one that made the statement. I was simply asking for documentation.
Once again, I'm not necessarily for or against relocating the clubs to this particular location.
I just post here primarily to support the club owner's right to what they were promised by the city after the city hosed them on their previous location.
And to combat the specious argument that these clubs are responsible for crime, as has been repeatedly suggested in these forums, mostly by people that never went to the clubs in their old location.
And also to combat the idea that these clubs will somehow ruin a neighborhood. There are strip clubs in Georgetown. Yet I don't see Georgetown property values falling.
Everyone gay person on this Forum knows what goes on in those Adult vidoes stores.
I must say that i didn't know 2120 was a Adult store of some sort until last 2 weeks since story broke about the strip clubs moving to W.Virginia Ave.
So I called a buddy of mine in Texas for regular chat and he goes on to tell me this story...
"A friend of mine just returned from DC and was telling him how DC was "off dah hook". He said he went to some after hours spot called 21(something) on virgina ave riht across the street from a police station. Once he got inside he was amazed that people were inside having SEX."
It wasn't until this morning driving into work, that I realized the Police Parking depot across from 2120. I'm appalled to know that Ward 5 now have a SEX club located right down the street from my house.
This is just ridiculous that these people think they should be entitled to such establishments in our neighborhoods.
This will create all types of cruising up and down the streets, it will attract huslters and prostitutes, it will continue the Spread of numerous sexually transmitted disease among the community etc........
There is nothing positive about having this type of business here.
i would welcome a STRIP club anyday over an Adult Store..
Personally, I'd have to agree with the last comment. I'm not thrilled about having Glorious Health & Amusements here. I would definitely prefer something more like Secrets or Wet to Glorious Health & Amusements. My understanding is that Glorious Health and Amusements does (again, this is just what I've heard) operate more like a bathhouse. That said, if you've got a bathhouse inside, I'm not sure why that would attract prostitutes outside. By the way, ANC 5B received two notices for ABL licenses from clubs in the group. These are from Nexus Gold Club (Ron Hunt) and Club 55. I believe that the ANC plans to protest both licenses.
In response as to why there would be prostitues outside? Because it is well know that guys(Mostly DL type guys) who are looking for hookups without having to go in these establishment cruises around the area looking for potential tricks. They sit in the parked cars, they circle the blocks 100x's etc....
As for the statistics, I honestly don't have any. I'm sure I've read it in some paper, but I can't show you solid proof. So I guess you can edit out my "statistics show..." statement :-) I'm only going on what I've heard and read about the problems that plague Amsterdam's red light district. I've also personally seen the violence and prostitution that goes on at a grouping of Philly strip clubs.
My own common sense, intuition, and experience just tell me that it's not the best idea to group things like bars and strip clubs together.
Luckily, because of the amendments that passed we won't have to worry about who's right or wrong in the discussion of whether grouping strip clubs together is bad or not.
And this is the stupidest cliche ever, but I have several gay friends, male and female. I am very far from being homophobic. You know, just in case you were wondering :-)
Alright, now can we all just be friends? It's Friday and beer time!
I think this arguement needs to shift focus from "STRIP" clubs to "SEX" clubs.
There is a big difference between the two.
If "EVERYONE" was to find out what goes on in those adult stores, I think everyone would agree they wouldn't stand a chance surviving in the nabe. They are surely giving the legit STRIP clubs a bad rep.
I went to the gay strip clubs in SE (granted, I wasn't a regular... it was more of a novelty for my occasional out of town lesbian or straight friend).
This was a pretty peaceful bunch of folks. To paraphrase, they were lovers, not fighters.
They were certainly less rowdy than, say, the patrons at a go-go club or many existing clubs here on the Hill.
And this would be a far cry from Amsterdam's Red Light District. First, obviously Amsterdam's is huge, not four tiny clubs. Second, a good number of drugs are legal in Amsterdam. That changes the equation. Third, Amersterdam's clubs are an international draw. I really doubt DC's four sad little clubs is even a regional draw.
And there are going to be some problems at any place where alcohol is served. But that's what you have the police for. And didn't someone mention that there's a police substation on this block?
I'm not saying there wouldn't be some impact. There is an impact from any new business. But to say there is an additional impact because they have nude dancers just isn't supportable.
And you mitigate those impacts through police and neighborhood enforcement, just like any other business.
And at the risk of being snide that area has much bigger problems than seeing a little naked weenie. Perhaps our efforts are better spent getting rid of the liquor stores, vagrants in the street, and stunning existing crime rate before we get all hot over what we imagine that the draw of weenie bar dancers will do.
I guarantee you even one liquor store or corner 40 ouncer store in this area generates far more problems than a strip club would.
As for the incoming development (by Abdo, I think?), I would think urban dwellers in DC are sophisticated enough to have no problem living close to where there are naked dancers.
After all, one of the hottest real estate locations in town is Logan, off of 14th St NW. And they have an actual cruise / sex gym on 14th (Crew Club). Everybody knows it, nobody cares, and it hasn't impacted the neighborhood. Certainly not more than the street winos and crack thugs that inhabit the neighborhood already, regardless of whether there is something sexually oriented there or not.
At the risk of being snarky, perhaps you're unaware of the internets? People don't have to cruise outside of anywhere to get sex now. They simply have to have an internet connection.
And even in the off chance that someone was in the vicinity of a stip club hoping to hook up (for money or not), it may actually improve the neighborhood. Maybe the'd take turf from the losers that stake out the neighborhood now. I'd much prefer them on my block than crack thugs and common street criminals, which are far too common in many DC neighborhoods, including the one in question, as it is.
You are correct about the distinction between sex-club and strip club, to a point.
It was my understanding that Glorious was the site of fairly frequent sex acts.
But as long as that was legal (and I'm not sure that it was), and if they were displaced by the city, then they deserve a right to relocate.
But the distinction between them and Wet and Edge is a valid one. I never saw sex acts in either Wet or Edge. In fact, they were sortof boring. (Once you've seen one skinny underfed dancer strut his stuff, you've pretty much seen them all.)
In fact, the Gay Liason division of the MPD made a point of monitoring these clubs to make sure of that.
Glorious, on the other hand, I don't know about. And, again, I don't know about the legality of consensual sex acts in a private club, which I assume Glorious technically was.
cuz.... i think you might have had some offers. ;o)
but i still have to say, as funny as your comment was, that we don't need ANY kind of strip club around here. i too would appreciate a lap dance by two amazingly gorgeous brunettes, with high heels, and....
i digress.
call me a NIMBY (not in my backyard), but i would rather take a hike to get my thrills.
I dunno. Historically, did your glass school move into that out-of-the-way area because it helped them avoid being harassed/beaten by the police, as they'd been when they were elsewhere? Did your glass school move there, and group together with other glass schools, in an effort to decrease the degree to which glass school students were beaten up just for being glass school students? Are glass schools things which are perfectly legal but nonetheless encounter a tremendous amount of NIMBY-ism, part (but not all) of which is born from bigotry? Does that NIBMY-ism make it hard for the glass school to relocate, once it was uprooted from the place it had gone to minimize the impact of others' bigotry?
If so, then I heartily encourage you to pursue it.
it's 2007. get with the program. it's a different world.
point is that any strip clubs can relocate there. dc will allow them to do that. i just hope that they aren't crappy clubs that attract flies, if you know what i mean. cuz... if they do, they WILL affect you.
and probably not in a really cool and like totally positive way.
anyway, they'll be gone in short time. i'm assuming that consenting adults will organize sex parties in their own homes, as opposed to risking it with dorks that perambulate the clubs.
btw, the HILLMAN, strip clubs in georgetown? technically, they're not in georgetown. they are like 2300 wisconsin avenue.....
different neighborhood.
AND they don't have private booths.
i know. i've been to both.
private booths are nasty.
i feel bad for the person that has to clean up all the ejaculation.
just don't want that crap in my hood.
do i support their existence? yeah, i do.
but put 'em in amsterdam or something. not in washington.
we already have enough bs with bush in office.
we don't want some other swallowers\spitters like the prez, on our street.
Anonymous/Poo Poo thinks refuting false statements, or asking people to back up their assertions with evidence, or pointing out ad hominem "arguments", equates to advocacy for the opposite point of view.
That's silly.
But it's much easier to knock down strawmen than discuss a point fairly, of course.
37 comments:
lame.
lame.
lame.
these clubs should sense the opposition to their relocation, and respect it.
the communities are probably really going to harass the clubs' patrons now that they got this cushy little deal.
whenever you force something through (when it's not wanted), you are BEGGING for trouble.
Is that a threat?
It seems that the compromise is at least equitable in the distribution of the clubs through each ward. In a perfect world, there could be an intersection between these clubs and other businesses that would create a vibrant atmosphere for everyone to enjoy. M St NW and Conn ave come to mind.
it's not a threat, dork.
it's speculation.
man, people are soooooooooooo touchy!
my point is that in the old days when the clubs went into that area, nobody cared, because no one cared about the area.
in 2007, people are actually very much articulate about how they feel about the clubs moving into the area. I HOPE that doesn't spell trouble, but if you look at similar examples, the possibility does indeed exist.
now settle down, and no more coffee for you!
hey, palace.
m street is not a viable comparison.
there are no 'private rooms' in the clubs you mention.
if they had private rooms, the community would not tolerate that.
Understood on the private rooms, just trying to look at the potential upside of the economic development, and mixed use area. My guess is that these types of clubs will be displaced again, when the NY Ave area is ready to be fully developed.
palace:
i dig what you say, but the fact is that a huge project is way past the purchase/planning stages, and it's right across the street.
here's an old planning link:
http://planning.dc.gov/planning/frames.asp?doc=/planning/lib/planning/project/ne_corridor/pdf/northeast_gateway_summary.pdf
and the other huge residential/retail/office complex across the street is called Washington Gateway (by ABDO, i think). someone posted the link to that recently on this blog.
the worry is that these places are going to interrupt stuff that has been being planned for years, and is months away from actually breaking ground.
Anonymous 10:19:
If you really are encouraging harassment of club patrons, prepare for them to fight back. The day of gay bar patrons allowing neighborhood residents to pester them is long over.
chill out.
it's not about fighting.
it's about appropriate development of the area.
i'm not THAT worried if they actually do relocate there. their time there is limited anyway.
i just don't want to see good development delayed.
and my hunch is that it won't. :o)
Anon 1:56-I suggested an alternate outcome in a previous post...what if the Abdo & other development go forward and the clubs' owners sell out because their property values go up? Like happened to some of them in the stadium area.
Seems like that could happen as well. Sound realistic? Some people have suggested that the locations might be better as grocery stores or other things...maybe a chain would offer to buy the property at a price that would tempt the club owner(s).
BTW: I'm not advocating this...just speculating about what might happen.
I am sure this is more than a possibility. One owner has sunk nearly 5 million on two buildings. If development comes in, and buys him out at a price, he/she has the ability to bank on their real estate, operate for the 2+ years for the developments to begin, and then get a deal for the next "undesireable"* neighborhood that is available.
*undesireable in the eyes of some (WashTimes etc)
ok, PC people.
strip clubs right next to a very cool and up and coming area is just not cool.
gay or straight.
selling dildos or pocket pussies.
just not cool, in this area.
in the seventies, you didn't have onlline porn. now you do. it's safer than these ramshackle establishments, and will likely prevail.
for some of you folks on this site, most of which i assume are transplants from other states in the U.S., you may think this is open territory for your little fetishes. it's not. open one of these places near your mom's or dad's house in iowa (etc.) and see how you feel about that.
you're probably not going to like it.
well, this is a city of residents too.
and the area in which little closed sex booths want to open is in an up and coming residential area.
ain't gonna happen.
even if it does, it's gonna fail.
there are too many educated people that care about real estate value to give a rat's butt about some losers watching another loser shake their booty.
go online.
much better variety, and less risk.
these places are doomed, particularly in this area.
everyone thinks it's a crap area that no one cares about. not true.
SE was a crap area that no one cared about, that's why the strip clubs moved there in the 70's.
this is not at all like that area.
folks have invested billions, yes BILLIONS in the area.
the little fetish clubs will survive for a while, but if you were really a big advocate about having long term gay/strip/sex clubs, you'd obviously look for another place.
there are areas farther north, and in anacostia that would keep you there for a while.
watch where the other club owners will be relocating. it isn't nearby.
you are delaying development, and filling the pockets of a bunch of folks that just want to make money. most of the club owners, by the way, are straight.
they're just looking to fill their pockets, while the gay folk sit around and claim discrimination, and probably would never frequent those clubs if they move, right hilldude?
they move, they make money, and everyone else that lives around the area gets angry if they live near, or doesn't care, if they live farther out - like hillman.
he's full of crap, and just wants to elicit the bigotry argument to justify some issues he thinks are prevalent in society. it makes an old queen feel like he's doing something.
wake up, dude. it's a different era.
arguing about relocating the clubs that you will not frequent, and not living by them, will not make your hair grow back, and it won't give you that ever so sexy six-pack.
get over it.
look after the interests of the whole city, not your personal issues.
go live in tijuana or thailand if you feel so strongly about screwing average citizens out of a possibly 'nice' neighborhood.
this is washington, dc, and we won't tolerate a bunch of loser places in one of the last places that average americans can still think about living the american dream. think "owning a house" where you can accumulate equity, sleep at night, etc.
if you want to watch naked people (gay or straight) call verizon and surf online for your little fetish.
don't bring a bunch of crap to an area where people actually want to create a home.
the issue is so slanted, it's sick.
it's not about homophobia. it's about creating a monumental city.
which, apparently, you aren't too keen on doing.
i seriously see the supporting folks moving outta here soon.
dc is not the place for private dancing rooms.
MD or VA is better suited for you.
you can't have it all, strip club supporters. and you won't.
i swear that i'm going to open a strip club in hillman's neighborhood, and see what he says.
will he be supportive of it?
only if it's a gay club.
and even then, i doubt he'd be organizing rallies to make it happen.
man, so many people are so short sighted.
seriously,
go back to idaho, or wherever.
this is not your playground.
You should put your name behind a post like that, you sad little coward.
hillman, do you think all straight people are homophobic or something? You seem to infer that a lot. Because to me that seems a little like stereotyping straight people...
If you are not please say so, I'm just trying to clarify.
Anonymous 9:57:
I'm only going to say you've got a lot of hate and anger going on, and that's not really what neighborhood online forums are for. And I agree with Chris, you need to man up and sign your name to a post like that.
In fact, this entire forum would be well served if the ability to post as Anonymous was done away with. It's especially confusing where there are multiple people claiming to be Anonymous in the same chat.
Roy: I've gone out of my way to say not all opposition to clubs is homophobia. I've said that numerous times.
I simply asked you to provide the statistics that you claim exist that say that grouping strip clubs together causes more crime. You are the one that made the statement. I was simply asking for documentation.
Once again, I'm not necessarily for or against relocating the clubs to this particular location.
I just post here primarily to support the club owner's right to what they were promised by the city after the city hosed them on their previous location.
And to combat the specious argument that these clubs are responsible for crime, as has been repeatedly suggested in these forums, mostly by people that never went to the clubs in their old location.
And also to combat the idea that these clubs will somehow ruin a neighborhood. There are strip clubs in Georgetown. Yet I don't see Georgetown property values falling.
Everyone gay person on this Forum knows what goes on in those Adult vidoes stores.
I must say that i didn't know 2120 was a Adult store of some sort until last 2 weeks since story broke about the strip clubs moving to W.Virginia Ave.
So I called a buddy of mine in Texas for regular chat and he goes on to tell me this story...
"A friend of mine just returned from DC and was telling him how DC was "off dah hook". He said he went to some after hours spot called 21(something) on virgina ave riht across the street from a police station. Once he got inside he was amazed that people were inside having SEX."
It wasn't until this morning driving into work, that I realized the Police Parking depot across from 2120. I'm appalled to know that Ward 5 now have a SEX club located right down the street from my house.
This is just ridiculous that these people think they should be entitled to such establishments in our neighborhoods.
This will create all types of cruising up and down the streets, it will attract huslters and prostitutes, it will continue the Spread of numerous sexually transmitted disease among the community etc........
There is nothing positive about having this type of business here.
i would welcome a STRIP club anyday over an Adult Store..
Btw- I am gay....
Personally, I'd have to agree with the last comment. I'm not thrilled about having Glorious Health & Amusements here. I would definitely prefer something more like Secrets or Wet to Glorious Health & Amusements. My understanding is that Glorious Health and Amusements does (again, this is just what I've heard) operate more like a bathhouse. That said, if you've got a bathhouse inside, I'm not sure why that would attract prostitutes outside.
By the way, ANC 5B received two notices for ABL licenses from clubs in the group. These are from Nexus Gold Club (Ron Hunt) and Club 55. I believe that the ANC plans to protest both licenses.
In response as to why there would be prostitues outside? Because it is well know that guys(Mostly DL type guys) who are looking for hookups without having to go in these establishment cruises around the area looking for potential tricks. They sit in the parked cars, they circle the blocks 100x's etc....
Anonymous (Hillman),
As for the statistics, I honestly don't have any. I'm sure I've read it in some paper, but I can't show you solid proof. So I guess you can edit out my "statistics show..." statement :-) I'm only going on what I've heard and read about the problems that plague Amsterdam's red light district. I've also personally seen the violence and prostitution that goes on at a grouping of Philly strip clubs.
My own common sense, intuition, and experience just tell me that it's not the best idea to group things like bars and strip clubs together.
Luckily, because of the amendments that passed we won't have to worry about who's right or wrong in the discussion of whether grouping strip clubs together is bad or not.
And this is the stupidest cliche ever, but I have several gay friends, male and female. I am very far from being homophobic. You know, just in case you were wondering :-)
Alright, now can we all just be friends? It's Friday and beer time!
I think this arguement needs to shift focus from "STRIP" clubs to "SEX" clubs.
There is a big difference between the two.
If "EVERYONE" was to find out what goes on in those adult stores, I think everyone would agree they wouldn't stand a chance surviving in the nabe. They are surely giving the legit STRIP clubs a bad rep.
Roy:
I went to the gay strip clubs in SE (granted, I wasn't a regular... it was more of a novelty for my occasional out of town lesbian or straight friend).
This was a pretty peaceful bunch of folks. To paraphrase, they were lovers, not fighters.
They were certainly less rowdy than, say, the patrons at a go-go club or many existing clubs here on the Hill.
And this would be a far cry from Amsterdam's Red Light District. First, obviously Amsterdam's is huge, not four tiny clubs. Second, a good number of drugs are legal in Amsterdam. That changes the equation. Third, Amersterdam's clubs are an international draw. I really doubt DC's four sad little clubs is even a regional draw.
And there are going to be some problems at any place where alcohol is served. But that's what you have the police for. And didn't someone mention that there's a police substation on this block?
I'm not saying there wouldn't be some impact. There is an impact from any new business. But to say there is an additional impact because they have nude dancers just isn't supportable.
And you mitigate those impacts through police and neighborhood enforcement, just like any other business.
And at the risk of being snide that area has much bigger problems than seeing a little naked weenie. Perhaps our efforts are better spent getting rid of the liquor stores, vagrants in the street, and stunning existing crime rate before we get all hot over what we imagine that the draw of weenie bar dancers will do.
I guarantee you even one liquor store or corner 40 ouncer store in this area generates far more problems than a strip club would.
As for the incoming development (by Abdo, I think?), I would think urban dwellers in DC are sophisticated enough to have no problem living close to where there are naked dancers.
After all, one of the hottest real estate locations in town is Logan, off of 14th St NW. And they have an actual cruise / sex gym on 14th (Crew Club). Everybody knows it, nobody cares, and it hasn't impacted the neighborhood. Certainly not more than the street winos and crack thugs that inhabit the neighborhood already, regardless of whether there is something sexually oriented there or not.
Anonymous 10:30:
At the risk of being snarky, perhaps you're unaware of the internets? People don't have to cruise outside of anywhere to get sex now. They simply have to have an internet connection.
And even in the off chance that someone was in the vicinity of a stip club hoping to hook up (for money or not), it may actually improve the neighborhood. Maybe the'd take turf from the losers that stake out the neighborhood now. I'd much prefer them on my block than crack thugs and common street criminals, which are far too common in many DC neighborhoods, including the one in question, as it is.
Inked:
You are correct about the distinction between sex-club and strip club, to a point.
It was my understanding that Glorious was the site of fairly frequent sex acts.
But as long as that was legal (and I'm not sure that it was), and if they were displaced by the city, then they deserve a right to relocate.
But the distinction between them and Wet and Edge is a valid one. I never saw sex acts in either Wet or Edge. In fact, they were sortof boring. (Once you've seen one skinny underfed dancer strut his stuff, you've pretty much seen them all.)
In fact, the Gay Liason division of the MPD made a point of monitoring these clubs to make sure of that.
Glorious, on the other hand, I don't know about. And, again, I don't know about the legality of consensual sex acts in a private club, which I assume Glorious technically was.
I just want a beer and a lap dance =)
Why settle when you can go to 2120 and get a Blow Job.
lol
I am straight you know...
glad you mentioned that, roy.
cuz.... i think you might have had some offers. ;o)
but i still have to say, as funny as your comment was, that we don't need ANY kind of strip club around here. i too would appreciate a lap dance by two amazingly gorgeous brunettes, with high heels, and....
i digress.
call me a NIMBY (not in my backyard), but i would rather take a hike to get my thrills.
when i come home, i wanna be home.
oh, by the way, can you be a bit more explicit about 2120?
is it nearby? are they expensive?
can i bike there?
do they take visa?
will the relocate to ivy city?
do i have to wait?
thanks in advance for the details!
there are a couple of guys at work dying to find out!
Gee my glass school was displaced by the baseball stadium, do you think that Mr. Graham will write special legislation for two of them in each ward?
I dunno. Historically, did your glass school move into that out-of-the-way area because it helped them avoid being harassed/beaten by the police, as they'd been when they were elsewhere? Did your glass school move there, and group together with other glass schools, in an effort to decrease the degree to which glass school students were beaten up just for being glass school students? Are glass schools things which are perfectly legal but nonetheless encounter a tremendous amount of NIMBY-ism, part (but not all) of which is born from bigotry? Does that NIBMY-ism make it hard for the glass school to relocate, once it was uprooted from the place it had gone to minimize the impact of others' bigotry?
If so, then I heartily encourage you to pursue it.
whatever, dude/dudette.
it's 2007. get with the program. it's a different world.
point is that any strip clubs can relocate there. dc will allow them to do that. i just hope that they aren't crappy clubs that attract flies, if you know what i mean. cuz... if they do, they WILL affect you.
and probably not in a really cool and like totally positive way.
anyway, they'll be gone in short time. i'm assuming that consenting adults will organize sex parties in their own homes, as opposed to risking it with dorks that perambulate the clubs.
btw, the HILLMAN, strip clubs in georgetown? technically, they're not in georgetown. they are like 2300 wisconsin avenue.....
different neighborhood.
AND they don't have private booths.
i know. i've been to both.
private booths are nasty.
i feel bad for the person that has to clean up all the ejaculation.
just don't want that crap in my hood.
do i support their existence? yeah, i do.
but put 'em in amsterdam or something. not in washington.
we already have enough bs with bush in office.
we don't want some other swallowers\spitters like the prez, on our street.
AND just to satisfy some folks on the group, this pain in the butt poster will no longer sign as ANONYMOUS.
i'll go by "poo poo". hopefully, the confused folks will be able to figure stuff out.
i post in a variety of names. even if inked decided to require names, i'd just modify.
it's a public forum.
i'm gracious enough to allow you to point your poison spears at "poo poo", so we can keep the anonymous posters in the house.
that's the point of a public forum, no?
or do some folks want an exclusive club where everyone espouses groupthink?
that would be totally lame.
if you've graduated from highschool you should know the effects of inbreeding.
let the people speak!
last thing.
HILLMAN:
i don't know who you are. and i don't care.
but i bet you love compliments from people that think you are in your thirties.
dunno why you are so for the clubs relocating to this particular area.
you're on the blog, so apparently, you're a local. what the hell are you thinking?
there are plenty of other places they can relocate.
why do you advocate that the move next door?
just curious...
oh, and i've been to amsterdam several times. and yes, i've been in private booths, so i know what i'm talking about.
they are disease laden.
nasty.
i went w/a friend of mine just to get the 'red light mojo'.
amsterdam, with an allocated red light district is fine.
if you're gonna do that in dc, then call it what it is.
Anonymous / Poo Poo:
Your fascination with me and my age is flattering (if somewhat disturbing), but pretty much irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
And to reiterate, once again, I am not advocating a relocation to this particular location. I've said that several times now.
Anonymous/Poo Poo thinks refuting false statements, or asking people to back up their assertions with evidence, or pointing out ad hominem "arguments", equates to advocacy for the opposite point of view.
That's silly.
But it's much easier to knock down strawmen than discuss a point fairly, of course.
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